Article: No Suspension For Miguel Sano

[Broker]

I have no idea what really happened and frankly it's none of my business. There may have been boorish behavior but nothing criminal. I hope this is the last I hear of it because it's going nowhere now.

[howeda7]

I'm surprised they didn't at least require some counseling. But I suppose they either had proof, in which case they would get blasted for going too light, or they didn't. 

 

I agree there are no winners in this. But given the amount of time that lapsed, it was never likely they would find definitive proof on this.

[howeda7]

 

It’s not likely to be an issue that goes away, particularly in the current climate.

Just about guarantee there will be protests at the Twins home opener and that Sano will hear all kinds of epitaphs thrown at him this year and beyond. It’s a distraction the team doesn’t need and one that Sano may or may not handle well.

I think I would almost rather have seen a 10 game or so suspension. That may have done more to “put this to bed” so to speak.

We’ll see how it plays out, but my guess this is far from the end of the story.

Honestly, I will be surprised if there are protests. There really hasn't been much talk about this since the week the story broke. And of course MLB announced it in a Friday news dump. In any event, I don't think a short suspension "just because" would have flied with the union or done anything to assuage protesters. 

[myjah]

I'm not surprised MLB made this decision, given the length of time since the incident and lack of evidence that could provide them an objective justification for a suspension.

 

I still believe the accuser, but I'm not surprised at the outcome. It's... whatever. What makes me more mad is people thinking this exonerates Miguel Sano somehow, or that this proves the accuser lied. It does not at all.

[scottz]

What makes me more mad is people thinking this exonerates Miguel Sano somehow.......It does not at all.

Out of curiosity, what would exonerate him?

[Mike Sixel]

Yeah, its going to be weird for Trevor May if and when he comes back. That's why players really should stay out of stuff like that.

IF a player believes something bad happened, he should just shut up and let it go? Is that your stance? If so, that's how bad things keep happening. If not, in not sure what you are saying.

[OldManWinter]

There are problems with "she said, he said". In general, how do you determine the true facts?

 

It is grossly unfair to publicly identify the accused without also identifing the accusser? In these particular circumstances, Sano will be punished. I think he will hear catcalls continually through this season and beyond.

 

But, it is way past the time for these attacks to continue.

 

May Sano spend the rest of his MLB career (and beyond) avoiding these setbacks in the future, but let's hope many others learn from it too.

[DocBauer]

I hesitate to weigh in here as I already did, at length, when this topic first came to light. Further, from the various responses here it remains a very touchy and loaded subject.

 

I felt all along, and the MLB investigation and comments have "backed up" my initial feelings, that there would be no suspension, good or bad, right or wrong, the amount of time, lack of witnesses, and no police report would seem to provide no "justification" for a suspension.

 

I deliberately put justification in quotes not to troll or create controversy. Simply as a statement of reality. With all due respect to every poster, and every member of the TD family, unless you are actually personally associated with either party involved, our involvement in this situation resides in being fans of the Twins and outliers of the situation. Period.

 

I am passing NO JUDGEMENT on either party in this situation. How could i? I have absolutely no first hand knowledge. The accuser has pressed no criminal charges, nor has she sought out monetary reperations. Does this make Sano guilty? Absolutely not. Nor does it exonerate him. At the end kf the day, it remains what it has been, a terribly uncomfortable turn of events that truly has no firm resolution.

 

Playing the part of a truly neutral party in this...again, how could I not be...i hope Betsy finds peace with her revelations. And it is my hope that Sano will learn from this situation, regardless of any guilt he may or not be party to, to mature as a man and make certain he is not put in to, or puts himself in to, again.

 

I feel passing judgement on either party is short-sighted. As a man, as a respectful lover of women, as a father, as a person who has been friends with and been involved with women who have been either accosted or abused, the big picture isn't about just baseball, or any blame or dispersion passed on either party involved. It should be about "what happens next"?

 

Perhaps the reported incidents in Chatanooga were very real. Perhaps they were blown out of proportion. Perhaps Sano did or said things just being "young and dumb". I don't know. Honestly, do you?

 

"What happens next?" is very real, however. There is a problem in society with situations of this nature. And again, this not about accusations to either party involved in this particular situation! In general, this is an opportunity for the Twins, and all of us really, to take a good hard look at education and tolerance.

 

I truly hope for the best for all parties involved. And message board, fan site or not, I really wish we could just close this ugly chapter and move on, with the exception of turning a blind eye.

[Brock Beauchamp]

As someone who knows Betsy both as a person and as a friend of Twins Daily, I really appreciate all of you who have participated in this thread and shown empathy for her situation without judgment. This is a difficult situation and I'm proud of how most of the posters on this site have talked about this delicate subject.

 

Maybe it's time to move on. Maybe MLB didn't find evidence to suspend Sano (but let's not conflate lack of evidence with innocence). As an individual, I do not know what happened that night but I know Betsy and I trust her statements. That doesn't mean I want to vilify Miguel Sano or run him off on rails; but it does mean I earnestly feel for Betsy and the hurt she obviously feels over this entire ordeal and I think that's something everyone should keep in mind while posting in this thread, and most of you have. Again, I thank all of you for showing restraint, consideration, and a little understanding before you post about this topic.

[rghrbek]

I will chime in only to say that I am a fan of Miggie.  Baseball only I am.  From the reactions when this came out from the many Twins Daily people both posters and others who knew the alleged victim, they supported her.  I cannot help feeling dirty, very dirty. I hope I am wrong for feeling this way but in most things I trust my gut.

Yuk

It's behind us now and we have to move on.  Just don't feel great about it.

Win Twins I guess?

[killertwinfan]

 

I'm not really sure MLB is the arbiter of the guilt/innocence in this situation. They had to investigate, and they should have. The lack of evidence is the reason he's not being suspended, not that he did or didn't do it. 

 

Like others, I hope he grows from this. I'm not quite sure where I fall, though I tend to lean towards the accuser in this case. 

 

That said, I think we can all be thankful that this isn't the NFL handling the investigation. 

 

The outcome makes me wonder if one read more into the result.  He wasn't given any discipline, no sensitivity training, no counseling, etc... It didn't seem that anyone disagreed with the incident happening, just the context of it. Is the league saying there is insufficient evidence that Sano's behavior (intent or actions) crossed the line? 

 

[Platoon]

I had expected a suspension. But I am not surprised there wasn't one either. I do believe however that something did happen that seriously upset the woman involved. First of all this was not an anonymous accusation. She put her credibility and her privacy on the line. Secondly, other examples of that sort of behavior towards women by Sano was made public. That's a lot of coincidences for someone like me, who isn't a believer in excessive coincidences. MLB, not the Twins made the decision on whether Sano would be disciplined. That can be debated till hell freezes over. But if I am Falvine I would have to imagine that there are real concerns here about whether Sanos lack of personal discipline will someday come at a bigger cost than his bat can cover. I hope Sano views this situation as a chance for a do over in the way he handles both his personal life, and his craft. But I really don't see that happening.

[DaveW]

 

It’s not likely to be an issue that goes away, particularly in the current climate.

Just about guarantee there will be protests at the Twins home opener and that Sano will hear all kinds of epitaphs thrown at him this year and beyond. It’s a distraction the team doesn’t need and one that Sano may or may not handle well.

I think I would almost rather have seen a 10 game or so suspension. That may have done more to “put this to bed” so to speak.

We’ll see how it plays out, but my guess this is far from the end of the story.

There won't be protests, people will move on like they always do (and should do). And it's sports, this team still honors Puckett left and right while conveniently ignoring his issues.

Re: this 'story'
I was very suspect about this story from the start, when no other real accusations came out I was even more suspect (sorry, but a 20 year old hitting on ushers at a baseball stadium is not a crime...maybe a bit creepy, and unprofessional, but not a crime)

I'm glad they can put this story/issue behind them, whether or not the incident happened (and to what degree) I do hope the accuser finds peace.

[Platoon]

There won't be protests, people will move on like they always do (and should do). And it's sports, this team still honors Puckett left and right while conveniently ignoring his issues.

Re: this 'story'

I was very suspect about this story from the start, when no other real accusations came out I was even more suspect (sorry, but a 20 year old hitting on ushers at a baseball stadium is not a crime...maybe a bit creepy, and unprofessional, but not a crime)

I'm glad they can put this story/issue behind them, whether or not the incident happened (and to what degree) I do hope the accuser finds peace.

The Puckett thing has certainly muted how his legacy is viewed. The film clips don't change, but I think the excitement isnt the same. And I ain't no prude. As for hitting on ushers, fan behavior shows you don't have to be only 20 to do that. But the fact that it was persistent enough that they felt the need to rotate ushers, and keep female ushers out of that area does indicate he crossed the flirting line.

[bird]

 

Out of curiosity, what would exonerate him?

 

Contemporaneous substantiation, which the investigators lacked.

[DaveW]

 

I do believe betsy that there was a stepping over the line by Sano. What i don't know is by how much. Was he blatantly over stepping the line, was he misled or did he misunderstand signals by her to a point before he crossed the line, what happened when the line was crossed? Did Betsy embellish what happened any to add drama and build her case further? And with the mixed testimonies and the fact that it was 2 years earlier and no one was physically damaged, I got the answer within the range of what I was expecting. 0 - 10 games. I do hope Sano learned where the line is at and steers clear of these allegations again. Moving forward that is the most important aspect and that protocols get put in place throughout the organization to keep this from happening in the future. I dont think Sano will avoid suspension a second time through this process and it may be longer as a result of additional investigations. I do think he did not intend to hurt or force himself on her either. I think these were actions of someone who is still growing up. So i hope no one holds a grudge on him either.

Very well stated, there was no proof whatsoever that any assault occurred. It was literally twitter vs facts/proof. That isn't to say that nothing did happen, it very well may have, but again no proof, and without proof you can't just take away a guys livelihood (especially for something years prior) when he has no means to defend himself more or less.

People bring up the minor league ballpark workers and are shaming Sano, while yes, maybe he was a bit creepy/unprofessional in some cases, it's important to note that he was still a young kid, basically the same age as a kid in college. It's also important to note that pro (and even college players) have women throwing themselves at them left and right, and like most people have good/fair/harmless intentions, of course some do not (a small minority), it can sometimes be tough especially for a young man who is from a different culture to know what is 'right' and what approaches 'the line' sometimes.

I think the key in moving fwd is educating all young athletes about both sides of the coin, as relationships, sex etc are rarely black and white and have lots of shades of gray in between.

Also the key is that he was a young man when this happened, people mature, people grow. 

Look at Molitor for instance, when all the news of his rampant cocaine use (including during games) came out it seemed to be an eye opener for him and he cleaned his act up, became a role model and eventually a hall of famer. I'd hate to see what twitter/internet culture would have said about Molitor if he was playing in 2017 and got busted for using blow and having it on his person during a game.

Basically, I'm all for (and yes happy) that Sano is getting a second chance, even though he very well may not have done anything 'illegal'/'wrong' in the first place. Hopefully he is able to learn from this, and hopefully his accuser finds peace.

[amjgt]

What makes me more mad is people thinking this exonerates Miguel Sano somehow, or that this proves the accuser lied. It does not at all.

Has literally anyone said these things?

[DrNeau]

 

Several of us actually know Betsy so I wouldn't call it "nothing". A few of the Twins Daily folks knew about it before Betsy said anything publicly.

 

You mean "knew about her claims", not "knew about it". In our legal system, there is no 'it' until 'it' is corroborated by a witness or evidence. No such witnesses or evidence ever were brought forth to support her claims. 

[Don Walcott]

I googled it, but couldn’t find anything about Sano and Chattanooga ushers other than posts on this site. Does anyone know if there is any other source for this allegation?

[prouster]

Sexual assault is not a "cultural thing." In fact, the act itself and its widespread toleration is very "American." Plenty of "Americans" do both. Harvey Weinstein. Our very own Garrison Keillor. A very prominent politician who is in the news every day. Lots of "Americans." Have you heard of Me Too, by any chance?

[yarnivek1972]

There won't be protests, people will move on like they always do (and should do). And it's sports, this team still honors Puckett left and right while conveniently ignoring his issues.

 

Re: this 'story'

I was very suspect about this story from the start, when no other real accusations came out I was even more suspect (sorry, but a 20 year old hitting on ushers at a baseball stadium is not a crime...maybe a bit creepy, and unprofessional, but not a crime)

 

I'm glad they can put this story/issue behind them, whether or not the incident happened (and to what degree) I do hope the accuser finds peace.

Perhaps I should have clarified. I’m not expecting large scale protest. But a half dozen or so wouldn’t surprise me. And if there are, one can be certain the media will call attention to them, because that is what the media does. And I absolutely think he will “hear it” on the road. Because that is what some fans do. Do whatever they can to try to get under the skin of the opponent.

[DaveW]

 

Perhaps I should have clarified. I’m not expecting large scale protest. But a half dozen or so wouldn’t surprise me. And if there are, one can be certain the media will call attention to them, because that is what the media does. And I absolutely think he will “hear it” on the road. Because that is what some fans do. Do whatever they can to try to get under the skin of the opponent.

What is there to protest though?

A girl made an accusation on social media, there was zero proof, MLB did a thorough investigation (and let's be clear, do you think if MLB THOUGHT that this happened or even was a decent chance of have happened they WOULDN'T have suspended Sano?) and they found zero evidence. Additionally there were never any criminal charges filed.

I'm all for the #metoo movement, but protesting a guy where there was literally zero evidence and zero pattern of behavior is just silly and honestly hurts the movement as a whole. 

[stockdogg]

Care to elaborate, crapforks? What do you expect? Her statement was just as much an accusation towards the Twins organization as it was towards Sano. Oh, im sure there is more to the story!!

[DaveW]

 

I googled it, but couldn’t find anything about Sano and Chattanooga ushers other than posts on this site. Does anyone know if there is any other source for this allegation?

It was a random tweet IIRC, seemed pretty loosey goosey with plenty of hearsay attached at the time IMO

[yarnivek1972]

What is there to protest though?

 

A girl made an accusation on social media, there was zero proof, MLB did a thorough investigation (and let's be clear, do you think if MLB THOUGHT that this happened or even was a decent chance of have happened they WOULDN'T have suspended Sano?) and they found zero evidence. Additionally there were never any criminal charges filed.

I'm all for the #metoo movement, but protesting a guy where there was literally zero evidence and zero pattern of behavior is just silly and honestly hurts the movement as a whole.

It’s simply a convenient platform to keep the issue relevant in the conciousness of people. There will be a large number of people and a relatively large media pressence.

[DaveW]

 

It’s simply a convenient platform to keep the issue relevant in the conciousness of people. There will be a large number of people and a relatively large media pressence.

I guess time will tell, I disagree but it's not worth arguing over I suppose.

[jokin]

 

What is there to protest though?

A girl made an accusation on social media, there was zero proof, MLB did a thorough investigation (and let's be clear, do you think if MLB THOUGHT that this happened or even was a decent chance of have happened they WOULDN'T have suspended Sano?) and they found zero evidence. Additionally there were never any criminal charges filed.

I'm all for the #metoo movement, but protesting a guy where there was literally zero evidence and zero pattern of behavior is just silly and honestly hurts the movement as a whole. 

 

Throwing the (former) first base coach's (superfluous) alleged behavior towards her into her allegations against Sano- was an immediate red flag to me- and it didn't seem to have helped her case with MLB, or to the basic right to the presumption of innocence inherent in our legal system.  

 

Weinstein, Cosby, et al are being justifiably taken down because victims have bravely pursued legal recourse and remedy- that apparently hasn't come close to happening in this case. I'll be the first to condemn Sano if and when charges are filed and the legal system can make a credible case against him.

Edited March 24, 2018 by jokin

[Squirrel]

Please keep this discussion directed on Sano, MLB’s decision and moving forward. If you want to have a broader discussion regarding race, culture, sexual assault and harassment, please do so in the Sports Bar. I think there are several threads still active on these issues. But please keep this thread as it specifically relates to Sano and the upcoming season. Like it or not, the MLB decision has been made. There is no reason to castigate anyone on any side of this. If you can’t do so, please refrain from posting or find a more suitable forum to have these discussions. That includes putting any shade on either Betsy or Sano.

[ashbury]

I googled it, but couldn’t find anything about Sano and Chattanooga ushers other than posts on this site. Does anyone know if there is any other source for this allegation?

Try this:

 

https://twitter.com/michaelholmdahl/status/946620730371985408

[DaveW]

 

Try this:

I think this is an issue and has to be taken with a huge grain of salt, it's just a random account of a random twitter user (not a reporter etc) and his conversation with a head usher.

I'm not saying it can't be considered, but I also think it's a little unfair to Sano for people to bring up the 'Chattanooga issues' as truth/gospel.