Article: Spring Training Storylines: Pitchers And Catchers

[jimmer]

You know who has been pretty consistently throwing 200 or more innings a season (if only barely).

 

Chris Archer. Who apparently is below average, according to some ;-)

[Tibs]

Holy cow that rotation would be horrendous

[Otto von Ballpark]

I just don't see Hughes in the rotation to start the season...bullpen maybe. There are only 2 games in April where we need a 5th starter,

Not sure if that is really true. Their only April off days are the first week and around the Puerto Rico trip. They don't have one in May until May 9th either. That's 9 straight days, then 19 straight days.

 

And even if you skip the 5th starter once or twice, you're not doing it to get more starts for a vet like Ervin Santana like we did last year. You are increasing the workload on guys like Berrios, Mejia, Duffey, etc.

 

I'd count on needing 5 starters the whole time.

[mikelink45]

 

They have? Gonsalves has 22 IP at AAA, and he gave up 14 runs. Romero has yet to throw a pitch in AAA, and had a 3.53 ERA in AA where the league ERA was 3.60.

If our TD writers are accurate, if their reports have considered all the trials and errors in their progress then I am ready to give them a chance.

[Otto von Ballpark]

If our TD writers are accurate, if their reports have considered all the trials and errors in their progress then I am ready to give them a chance.

I think the TD writers like them in context as prospects, but I'm not sure they've advocated for their immediate promotion to the majors. Perhaps they argued for a faster promotion to AAA last year, particularly for Gonsalves, but in absence of that I don't think they'd recommend essentially skipping AAA altogether based on spring training performance.

[Dantes929]

 

You know who has been pretty consistently throwing 200 or more innings a season (if only barely).

Chris Archer. Who apparently is below average, according to some ;-)

I've seen people say he is not worth our starting right fielder plus 3 of our top prospects but have not seen anyone say below average.  I might have missed it.

[Blackjack]

I hope Berrios handles the pressure (and more added pressure of being the opening day starter) and comes out throwing like the ace we all think and hope he's going to be.   I'm concerned that hes going to get amped up and be horrible the first few starts.

 

[Teddy]

 

I've seen people say he is not worth our starting right fielder plus 3 of our top prospects but have not seen anyone say below average.  I might have missed it.

 

I wouldn't pay that price unless it was someone like Clayton Kershaw with a Cy Young under his belt. Archer has been too inconsistent to justify that price.

[Oxtung]

 

I wouldn't pay that price unless it was someone like Clayton Kershaw with a Cy Young under his belt. Archer has been too inconsistent to justify that price.

Kershaw would cost considerably more. This is the piece that people seem to forget. If you only are willing to trade for (or sign) one of the top 5 pitchers in all of baseball their price is going to be considerably higher! A trade package for Kershaw starts with Buxton and includes several other high end pieces.

[Dantes929]

 

I hope Berrios handles the pressure (and more added pressure of being the opening day starter) and comes out throwing like the ace we all think and hope he's going to be.   I'm concerned that hes going to get amped up and be horrible the first few starts.

Sometimes I think it would be smart to just flip the rotation.    I think the perception out there right now is that we will at a large disadvantage at every spot in the rotation.   I think the reality is that we will be at a slight to moderate disadvantage at every spot in the rotation, at least until Santana gets back.   If you flip the rotation you are at a disadvantage in the 1st two spots, slight disadvantage in the 3rd spot and a slight to moderate advantage in the 4th and 5th spots.   Just seems like the numbers would come out a little better that way.   If we get a guy like Cobb then we would have the advantage in maybe 3 spots.  Of course this all depends on the opponent.   Maybe not so smart this year but I still think the idea of having Berrios start in the 3rd or 4 games instead of the 1st is reasonable.

[jimmer]

I've seen people say he is not worth our starting right fielder plus 3 of our top prospects but have not seen anyone say below average. I might have missed it.

on another thread. The one about twins making an offer for archer. Poster said Archer was a below average pitcher the last two years. Edited February 13, 2018 by jimmer

[twinssporto]

 

Saw a photo of him throwing a bullpen yesterday. I'm not counting on him for anything, though.

I'm going to Tweet some pics of me throwing the ball with my kid in the yard today.  I might qualify for a starting spot in the rotation this year...

[Steve Lein]

 

I'm going to Tweet some pics of me throwing the ball with my kid in the yard today.  I might qualify for a starting spot in the rotation this year...

 

Exactly

[Rosterman]

The Twins have a bunch of pitchers to make a quick decision about before their value plummets. Are Romero and Jorge actually in the plans, or can still cater trade possibilities. Do you cut ties with Phil Hughes? Is May a starter or bullpen guy (could May close). Duke, Reed and Rodney have pushed back the youngsters, who have done a pretty good job of pushing themselves back, too...how does Chargois, Reed, Melotakis, Busenitz fit into the future bullpen plans or will they be pushed aside by others.

 

Is Garver best served riding the bench, or actually catching games pitched by Jorge, Romero and Gonsalves at AAA for a good part of the season. Actually working behind-the-plate and keeping those skills developed.

 

But if the Twins add a Bobby Wilson, they need 40-man spaces. Too many "prospects" on the 40-man roster! TraideBait if you can get proven talent...better than letting them walk via the waiver wire.

[caninatl04]

We have a brilliant new front office. Oh, by the way, our #2 starter is Kyle Gibson.

 

Both of these statements cannot be true simultaneously.

[Dan In Real Life]

Am I alone in being far more optimistic about the bullpen going into the season? I get that last year is not a high bar to clear, but they've got the makings of a more-than-decent bullpen. I actually really like the idea of Hughes in the bullpen, if he's around at all.

[mikelink45]

 

I think the TD writers like them in context as prospects, but I'm not sure they've advocated for their immediate promotion to the majors. Perhaps they argued for a faster promotion to AAA last year, particularly for Gonsalves, but in absence of that I don't think they'd recommend essentially skipping AAA altogether based on spring training performance.

No they have not advocated that, I am suggesting the Twins be open to that.  But the TD reports give me confidence that they might be ready.

[Richie the Rally Goat]

I think the TD writers like them in context as prospects, but I'm not sure they've advocated for their immediate promotion to the majors. Perhaps they argued for a faster promotion to AAA last year, particularly for Gonsalves, but in absence of that I don't think they'd recommend essentially skipping AAA altogether based on spring training performance.

im having a hard time finding the quote, but my recollection is Falvey has said things to a similar effect. I recall him saying that prospects would get goals and feed back throughout and the desired result would be maybe a little less time in rookie ball and low, and more time in double and triple A, where it made sense.

 

Seems like Lewis and Rooker are going through the lower levels a bit faster than how I remember the TR era of management would have them progress.

[tarheeltwinsfan]

Brothers and Sisters: We entered the off season needing a # 1 SP and a #4 SP in order to contend with the Cleveland Mudrats. The sun is shinning today in Ft. Myers! The pitchers and catchers have reported. We have gotten neither a #1 nor a #4 SP. Let's all rise, grab out song books and sing the first verse of, "It's Now or Never"...page 18 in our books. Let's all sing loudly, so the guys upstairs in the front office can hear us. A one and a two...

[Doctor Wu]

I don't see how Hughes could even be considered for the starting rotation to start the season. Hey, I'd love to be proved wrong and see him revert to the form he showed 3 or 4 years back, but I think that's highly unlikely at this point, especially since he's coming back from an injury. I'm guessing someone with a tad of MLB experience, such as Slegers, would have more of a chance to earn a spot.

[FormerMinnasotan]

I don't see how Hughes could even be considered for the starting rotation to start the season. Hey, I'd love to be proved wrong and see him revert to the form he showed 3 or 4 years back, but I think that's highly unlikely at this point, especially since he's coming back from an injury. I'm guessing someone with a tad of MLB experience, such as Slegers, would have more of a chance to earn a spot.

Or Felix Jorge...

[Oxtung]

 

I don't see how Hughes could even be considered for the starting rotation to start the season. Hey, I'd love to be proved wrong and see him revert to the form he showed 3 or 4 years back, but I think that's highly unlikely at this point, especially since he's coming back from an injury. I'm guessing someone with a tad of MLB experience, such as Slegers, would have more of a chance to earn a spot.

 

In general I think making roster decisions based off a few weeks of spring training results is a terrible idea. However, in the case of a player returning from injury, and especially a multi year injury, it makes sense to use this time to discern his health. I don't even care about his stats; what is his velocity, how about his arm slot/angle, how much break are his balls getting? To me that is what Spring Training can actually tell us.

 

All of that is to say we know roughly what we should get from Slegers/Jorge and it's a 4.5-5 ERA. If Hughes can recover he should be better than that. Let's wait and see before we close the door on him yet.

[Vanimal46]

Brothers and Sisters: We entered the off season needing a # 1 SP and a #4 SP in order to contend with the Cleveland Mudrats. The sun is shinning today in Ft. Myers! The pitchers and catchers have reported. We have gotten neither a #1 nor a #4 SP. Let's all rise, grab out song books and sing the first verse of, "It's Now or Never"...page 18 in our books. Let's all sing loudly, so the guys upstairs in the front office can hear us. A one and a two...

We're also starting a protest in a furniture store later today! It's called "Bummin' it for Bumgarner"

 

We will refuse to get off of the couches in the showroom until the Twins trade for him!

 

Hmm, this may take a few days.... So we're switching up the location to IKEA! We'll stay nourished on sweedish meatballs until something happens!

[gocgo]

 

Not sure if that is really true. Their only April off days are the first week and around the Puerto Rico trip. They don't have one in May until May 9th either. That's 9 straight days, then 19 straight days.

And even if you skip the 5th starter once or twice, you're not doing it to get more starts for a vet like Ervin Santana like we did last year. You are increasing the workload on guys like Berrios, Mejia, Duffey, etc.

I'd count on needing 5 starters the whole time.

I think starters like to be in the rhythm of starting every 5 days early on.  As the season grinds on, that extra day can give them a needed break or even skip a turn in the rotation if necessary.  I'll stick with the prediction that we break with 4 starters and an extra body in the bullpen as we don't tend to stretch out starters early.  I think they only need a 5th starter on the 11th and the 24th.  They can do that by sending down the extra bullpen body or by putting someone on the 15 day DL and bringing up a starter for that period starting on the 11th.  Of course all this assumes (dangerously) that Erv will be ready in early May.

[laloesch]

 

Gonsalves and Romero have to be told that it is up to them whether they are Twins or minor leaguers.  Its time to step up.  

 

It's a bit early for that, is it not?  I mean Romero has never pitched in AAA and Gonsalves has what 22 innings in AAA ball.  I think at the very least Gonsalves pitches at least half the season in Rochester and the same for Romero assuming he starts in AAA. 

 

Look for that #4 spot I think it comes down to Hughes, Slegers and Enns to start the season.  And to be honest I got a pretty good vibe from Slegers and Enns last season.  Slegers with not overpower you but the kid can pitch and he has a healthy arm compared to Hughes who has broken down several years in a row. 

[ashbury]

I think starters like to be in the rhythm of starting every 5 days early on.  As the season grinds on, that extra day can give them a needed break or even skip a turn in the rotation if necessary.  I'll stick with the prediction that we break with 4 starters and an extra body in the bullpen as we don't tend to stretch out starters early.  I think they only need a 5th starter on the 11th and the 24th.  They can do that by sending down the extra bullpen body or by putting someone on the 15 day DL and bringing up a starter for that period starting on the 11th.  Of course all this assumes (dangerously) that Erv will be ready in early May.

With 6 days between starts for the first go-round, and 5 days for the second, I could see going with a four-man rotation all the way twice through, meaning no need for a fifth starter until Lucky Friday April 13. Do they all need 6 days that second time? Did I count wrong?

[gocgo]

 

With 6 days between starts for the first go-round, and 5 days for the second, I could see going with a four-man rotation all the way twice through, meaning no need for a fifth starter until Lucky Friday April 13. Do they all need 6 days that second time? Did I count wrong?

I was thinking that the #2 starter would get shortened rest that 2nd time thru, but I may have counted wrong.  He'd pitch on the 7th, have the 8th, 9th, 10th to recover while the 3, 4, and 1 pitch, so I think we would need that 5th starter on the 11th.

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

I think starters like to be in the rhythm of starting every 5 days early on.  As the season grinds on, that extra day can give them a needed break or even skip a turn in the rotation if necessary.  I'll stick with the prediction that we break with 4 starters and an extra body in the bullpen as we don't tend to stretch out starters early.  I think they only need a 5th starter on the 11th and the 24th.  They can do that by sending down the extra bullpen body or by putting someone on the 15 day DL and bringing up a starter for that period starting on the 11th.  Of course all this assumes (dangerously) that Erv will be ready in early May.

Assuming 4 starters in regular rotation, we'd need a 5th starter on April 11, 24, 29, and May 4.  Basically "skipped" twice in that span, the first week and the third week (around the Puerto Rico trip).

 

Depending on how they did it, they could skip them on their next off day May 9th too, but you would need them by May 14th again.

 

The DL is only 10 days now, so that helps, but I don't see them pushing Berrios, Mejia, etc. Early last season they were skipping the 5th guy a bit (Mejia?) but the other 4 spots were veterans (Ervin, Santiago, Hughes, and Gibson).

[ashbury]

I was thinking that the #2 starter would get shortened rest that 2nd time thru, but I may have counted wrong.  He'd pitch on the 7th, have the 8th, 9th, 10th to recover while the 3, 4, and 1 pitch, so I think we would need that 5th starter on the 11th.

Weather could wind up playing a factor anyway, so I've already overthunk this one.

[Brock Beauchamp]

 

Weather could wind up playing a factor anyway, so I've already overthunk this one.

Yeah, it's a bad idea to even look at the April schedule and try to sort a rotation when your favorite team plays outdoors in Minneapolis.