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Article: Twins Daily's Long-Term Future And Writers


John Bonnes

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Twins Daily is always a must read for me everyday. The work on here is excellent. I would suggest going to Thrylos Blog and look at all the past bloggers that have stopped writing. He has a list of them on the left hand side of his page. I would suggest reaching out to them to occasionally post here at Twins Daily. I like diverse views on what the Twins should be doing to make themselves competitive. Another thing I noticed a few years back was there were a number of regulars on this site that would kind of talk down to the regular fan who made comments about there twitter post. They kind of made there views seem trivial and stupid. I think that turns off the Average Joe Fan greatly. I would suggest that they be a little more open minded about comments made to their posts on twitter. There are varying degrees of knowledge of the Twins inner workings. Lighten up on Twitter responses. I know that there are several regular contributors that I have stopped following on twitter because of that. No one needs to be talked down to. Most of the time when I see a post by them on Twins Daily I just pass right by that post. They became full of themselves and I don't need that.

I completely agree. I have often thought about writing a piece but feedback given to many who have posted thoughts on articles have been overly negative. I am not adept at fancy stats so if i post what my eyeballs tell me, it gets shut down by stats guys - probably correctly, but frustrating never the less. TD is my go-to site for Twins coverage and I want it to flourish.

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Thank you for this article.  I guess you would consider me to be an 'organically-grown' member, currently in the commentating stage, unsure if I'll move past this point, partly due to a lack of time (baby #3 due April!) and partly due to a lack of writing ability.  I have good spelling and grammar, I can tell a good joke here and there, I can do diligent research, but I will have a hard time writing a cohesive story.  Before I get to your questions, my first suggestion is to pair people up to write articles.  My thought is, I could do (and enjoy) researching a topic, making up my talking points, jokes, and such.  But the final stage of making it pretty and readable with good flow is daunting and will take me too much time, to the point where the interest in that particular story might already be past (last week's story is thus, last week's story).  Now the hard part of this pairing process, is that I'm guessing there's a low number of people on this site who are quality writers and weak towards baseball/technical stuff.

 

If you’ve written for Twins Daily, what was the experience like? N/A

How do we better manage and administer the recruitment and development of independent voices? Might need to look outside of the hardcore Twins fan community.

What is a fair price to compensate our writers? Or the person who curates/tends/ manages our writers? Unfortunately I'm assuming you'd be unable to provide what is 'fair,' at least according to what freelance writers make.  I do think you should pay per page view, at least for most writers.  You might consider paying the senior writers per word or per article, that way they can get paid up front.  You know what to expect from your senior writers so you probably won't lose any money on this (as long as you have the money up front).

 

How can we give feedback to our writers as a community? Or let them know just how popular their stories are? I'll have to think on this.  I haven't written, so I'm not sure.

 

How can we get the word out that developing writers is a focus of Twins Daily? How would we restructure the site to emphasize that? (And do you agree it should be?)  See next response.

 

Would you like to hear more voices? How can we best do that?  I'd be interested in hearing more voices, and perhaps having those voices be more focused.  I see a bit of this already, but I'd be interested in seeing there be a lead writer on certain subjects (e.g. Red Wings lead writer, Lookouts lead writer, high A lead writer, low A lead writer, and various Twins writers like for starting pitchers, bullpen, lineup, advanced analytics, game recaps, etc.  I'd like to be able to go to the front page of the website and find the page of articles in the subject I'm interested in.  Right now everything is combined in the scrolling front page, or hidden somewhere that I can't find it.  With the setup right now, I feel like the current content will dictate how my visit to the site goes.  By all means, keep the feature articles highlighted on the front page.  BUT, I'd rather have my mind made up ahead of time (e.g. I'd like to read about AAA prospects and advanced analytics about the Twins fielding today) and already know where I'd need to go on the site to view that material.  I can see that there is an attempt to do this with the 5 tabs currently at the top-right of the site, but the selections are limited and a bit hodgepodge.  You guys have TONS of articles.  If you could find a way to sort them better and streamline the site, you'd get WAY more views, I'd enjoy each visit better, and I'd be more likely to read older articles as they won't be so buried.

 

PS an aside: I'd personally prefer to see replies and comments arranged more like a tree/web, say how Facebook does it (where a reply to one comment gets stacked under that comment), as opposed to the current setup which just chronologically stacks everything.  It is so tedious to flip through the comments quickly.

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This is probably the first time most of us have heard of the goal to grow the writer's community here. I think you just gotta get the word out.

 

As for "negativity" -- and this is a side point -- from my observations a small majority of the negativity in Twins Territory is a small group of people complaining about negativity. Our community is very meta.

 

TD does a good job of keeping the personal attacks down and unlike another Twins site the power here isn't abused by the mods to attack/bait people without consequences. I don't always agree with the mod decisions but I know they have a tough job and I can see the overall results are good.

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Perhaps a different incentive for posting rather than the $2 per page view? Maybe the top ten contributors (page views, comments, or likes) listed on the main page of TD with links to their blog homes?  Could there could special blogger social events scheduled? Other perks -perhaps a select a blogger article to feature in the off-season handbook? Perhaps a free copy of the off-season handbook to bloggers with X number of yearly page views? 

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I was unaware of the search for new writers. I was aware of the blogs section but have never really spent time reading from there.

 

Perhaps a link to a permanent page explaining the search and possible pay of writing for the blogs and eventually the site. Also regularly (weekly/monthly/or bimonthly) promoting a blog to the front page would keep the idea fresh in the viewers minds that there are other articles in the blog sections.

 

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I have a couple posts I would like to write, but I know I won't. You are thinking bigger picture than what I am suggesting, but I know of some content I would really like to read:

 

1-The TD community has a couple posters who are avid fans of at least one other baseball team. If you were to reach out to them for articles drawing comparisons between the Twins and another team's position battles for the upcoming season, I would read the heck out of that. 

 

2-Prospect lists are always going to get me to click. An article which broke down some interesting storylines for recent 'never quite made it' prospects (Joe Benson, Shooter Hunt, etc.) and what might have been would be interesting. I know theres a lot if interesting info about these ballplayers as humans as well as what obstacles might have prevented them from reaching their potential.

 

3-I would really like more info on the ballpark experience. This gets covered in the main forum somewhat, but it would be cool if it had a separate forum or sub-forum. I live out of state and try to make it to MN every summer. It would be cool to have some sort of researchable collection of information re: concession changes, ballpark renovations, promos, discounts, must see features, etc. If there were some other items to combine in the forums, even better. Maybe a sub-forum for Target Field, the neighborhood and the navigation. People could share parking or transit tips, great value seats, favorite pre-game watering holes, maybe even some meet-ups. This multi-forum setup on TD is really underused, as evidenced by so many topics in the main forum moved to another by a moderator. People forget about the other forums. I got off topic. Sorry.

 

4-Redoing the Blog section to make it more interactive, maybe adding "Blog Requests." I have no idea how that might look, but it would be cool to check in on and see some element of something I was kicking around in my head as a request. Example request: "Numerically rate the potential 5-8 starting pitcher options without giving weight to the notion of development or long term value." Ideas like that could be fun, brainless research posts which might create some great discussion.

 

I know John was looking for ways to curate a more thriving community of longer form contributors and I only offered one-off posting ideas, but I would like to see this site continue to grow and thrive. Whenever MLBTR has their Blogs Weigh In feature, I always click to see if TD is on there. Its a nice feeling when it is. The content here is really great, and the forums are second to none. 

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I agree with a lot of what is said above. I read 99% on mobile and don't see the blogs. Or even the message boards for that matter. Usually just check for new articles on the front page (Daily and sometimes multiple) and if I don't see anything I move on. Would be nice for this to be more easily accessible. If they were I'd read them all and imagine others would as well. I have a good group of friends that are big time twins fans but not to the point of following them daily. So i enjoy coming here daily to interact with people that nerd out like myself. I also like the idea of more avenues for Twins media. Like YouTube videos, podcasts, ect. I listen to Gleeman and the Geek regularly. Only gripe with it is that it's 60-90 min and usually only half is Twins related. I love TD and it'd make it hard to be a Twins fan without it. Startribune just isn't very good and the comments give me a headache. Pioneer Press has good info from Mike Berardino but there isn't much comment interaction. And nowhere else covers the minor leagues like TD does. Love the work you guys do and hope it keeps going strong and growing.

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I'm going to insert a little technical 'how to' since several have mentioned not finding the blogs easily in mobile navigation. There's a little 4-paned grid in the upper right corner ... when you touch that, the top row of choices is: Articles, Forums, Blogs. Make sure you are using the mobile version to see this. That grid is there no matter where you are on the site for easy access to other parts.

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Tom and others hit the nail on the head. The forums get way more traffic and response than the blog section. It also appears that blogs are more thoughly researched topics... Which doesn't really fit me.

 

I'm quite happy writing comedy bits like Twins' 12 Days of Christmas, Whine Line, and silly game thread topics.

Hey, you could do a regular comedy blog ... everyone wanting to read your 'hawt takes' on a weekly 'whine line' basis might draw traffic to the blogs! :)

 

Blogs don't have to be thorougly researched writing ... they can be anything. I think that's why some maybe are hesitant. Yes, many use blogs because they want to write seriously about their favorite sports teams, or whatever else, but not all blogs have to be that. A good humorous or reflective kind of blog on a semi-regular basis is awesome. One I used to read all the time ... but hasn't been around at all recently ... was Peanuts from Heaven. Perfect example of just writing because he had something he wanted to say. That kind of 'human nature' writing is something I  really like along side the more researched topic driven blogs.

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The pay is painfully low. The blogs are not promoted enough on TD. My gut instinct is that most readers/commenters are happy with the content currently on TD. If you truly want to expand the blogs and independent writers, then get a separate website for that activity (which you could link to on TD). When I come to TD today I want the good content from the strong writers about 98% of the time. The other 2% of the time I will search around and look at the blogs. If the blogs had their own separate website I could focus my time there more efficiently and effectively. Right now, it is obvious that TD does not emphasize the blogs.

 

John Bonnes has the time to be on the radio with KFAN. While not denying him the opportunity to run his career the way he wants to, it feels hollow that he speaks of a lack of time to curate the blogs on TD while expanding his media footprint elsewhere. TD might or might not be John's #1 priority - it is obviously not his only priority and my guess is that these other media opportunites of his greatly detract from the cultivation of TD blogs.

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Another thought ... for those of you who do write blogs and also comment on the various article and forum threads, self promote. If a thread or article pops up on something you've written about, jump into the conversation and say, 'Hey, I totally agree/disagree with that because of this. I even wrote a blog about it here!' and provide the link. While many won't click on the link to read what you said, many will.

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I don't know if this is the right forum to bring this up... But one thing that's kind of frustrating is locking threads when someone "breaks" Twins news then a formal article is written an hour or 2 later about the topic.

 

I don't really want to repeat myself if I commented on a forum breaking the news. And sometimes there's good conversations happening that get locked because one of Seth, Tom, or whoever writes an article about it.

 

So maybe find a way to merge the forums together? I know there's been some frustrations in the past. Because like reporters, we all take pride in finding the scoop first.

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I don't know if this is the right forum to bring this up... But one thing that's kind of frustrating is locking threads when someone "breaks" Twins news then a formal article is written an hour or 2 later about the topic.

I don't really want to repeat myself if I commented on a forum breaking the news. And sometimes there's good conversations happening that get locked because one of Seth, Tom, or whoever writes an article about it.

So maybe find a way to merge the forums together? I know there's been some frustrations in the past. Because like reporters, we all take pride in finding the scoop first.

Super annoying. I just want a good conversation. This practice hurts that.

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Hey, you could do a regular comedy blog ... everyone wanting to read your 'hawt takes' on a weekly 'whine line' basis might draw traffic to the blogs! :)

 

Blogs don't have to be thorougly researched writing ... they can be anything. I think that's why some maybe are hesitant. Yes, many use blogs because they want to write seriously about their favorite sports teams, or whatever else, but not all blogs have to be that. A good humorous or reflective kind of blog on a semi-regular basis is awesome. One I used to read all the time ... but hasn't been around at all recently ... was Peanuts from Heaven. Perfect example of just writing because he had something he wanted to say. That kind of 'human nature' writing is something I really like along side the more researched topic driven blogs.

True, that's something to think about. It still goes back to forums in Minnesota Twins Talk getting more traffic and comments compared to the blog section...

 

As you know my comedy bits thrive on others going along with it.

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Tom and others hit the nail on the head. The forums get way more traffic and response than the blog section. It also appears that blogs are more thoughly researched topics... Which doesn't really fit me.

I'm quite happy writing comedy bits like Twins' 12 Days of Christmas, Whine Line, and silly game thread topics.

I'm right there with you when it comes to game threads. That's what I truly enjoy.

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“The mission of Twins Daily is to gather a community of passionate readers around a core of independent, intelligent, and entertaining Twins writers.”

 

“We haven’t had the success we anticipated we could have in developing a large group of independent Twins writers. When we designed Twins Daily, we attempted to create an organic model for growth. Readers become commenters, and eventually they try writing, which they do on their blogs, and then we promote those to the front page.”

I’d like to offer something to this discussion without sounding either long-winded or pedantic. It is an endeavor at which I have often failed. Past failures aside, I occasionally do make a point. Most times accidentally.

 

I am both an avid reader and an avid writer. It’s been my experience that the two traits are not often simpatico. A person can be one or the other, or both, but not necessarily to the same degree of “avidness”. In other words, some folks love reading, but either cannot, or have absolutely no desire to pen anything longer than a “Thank You” note while others write well but abhor reading anything longer than a “Thank You” note.

 

Perhaps this explains the popularity of Twitter.

 

I consider myself a semi-professional writer in that I have been paid for my writing efforts; not enough to retire a millionaire, but enough to remain retired without boosting cars or rolling drunks in order to avoid starvation. Though the pay is about the same. For weighting purposes you may consider me a Triple A level writing prospect who will probably never make the Bigs; a sucker for the off-speed pitch.

 

I discovered my own writing interest as a sophomore in high school English composition class. My classmates, often for their own questionable motives, always clamored for me to read my writing assignments to the class, much to the chagrin of our instructor; the Nun of This, Nun of That. To this day, a half century later, I am the only one of my one hundred and fifty classmates who has ever been published anywhere about anything, though many still clamor to read my work. Was I the only classmate who had an ability to write? Far from it. But I was the only one who had the desire to be a writer.

 

Point offered; you can’t reasonably expect to make ordinary readers into “independent, intelligent, and entertaining writers” with any great degree of success. Writers are born, in my opinion, not made. If a person does not harbor a desire to write, he will not become a writer despite all incentives offered to do so.

 

That’s not to say you shouldn’t encourage those who demonstrate the desire. My initial encouragement came from my classmates. And there’s nothing like recognition from your peers when it comes to encouragement. TD’s “Like” system offers that to a degree. Perhaps an additional system based on the number of “likes” earned over the year, or average earned per written effort, and then turn it over to TD readers for a separate vote in some sort of annual award system like “All Star” ,  “Rookie of the Year,” “Gold Glove”, etc. etc. You could break it down by the various TD features; Forum, Article, Thread, Commentary whatever. Make it a fun thing. Throw in a Bob Uecher Award for best tongue-in-cheek writing, a Sandy Koufax Award for the writer that throws the most curveballs, etc. Post the winners on TD and email each winner a certificate they can print out and hang on their refrigerator at home. Recognition and maximum encouragement with minimal cost.

 

As for my own TD reading habits, I seldom read blogs, mostly gloss over analytical articles, read almost everything regarding minor league prospects, peruse the “what if” articles for off-the-wall ideas, usually catch Tom’s game wrap-ups, but NEVER EVER miss game threads. Even written a few myself. I’ve gone so far as to “listen/watch” a Twins game on the threads alone. No radio. No TV. Why? Quips, banter, one-liners and the occasional intelligent observation.

 

Maybe TD has to win this one for the Quipper.

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Step 1: Get a QB. You'll need someone dedicated to make sure efforts are rewarded with a prominence. If content falls through the cracks you may not get a 2nd. Make sure the QB understands the overall goal of TwinsDaily. 

 

Step 2: Don't over Filter. Your designated QB will need to perform some quality control but always remember that perfection is the enemy of the good. 

 

Step 3: Open the content doors wide. There is only so much Twins content out there. A majority of the information is locked away in the front office closets and not reachable for us mere mortals. If the content makers feel limited in what they have to write... inspiration will come much slower. Foster and encourage creativity in whatever direction it goes. 

 

Step 4: Strength in Numbers - Understand that finding a prolific work horse like Seth Stohs or Nick Nelson is a very hard thing to find. It will be difficult to find people who can match that kind of output so you have to be OK with some one and done's to fill the content hole.  

 

Step 5: Use the LIKE button. At bare minimum... you need to let the content creators know that you read what they put down. Nobody is going to get rich doing this... validation for their efforts with a simple acknowledgement is what they are looking for. Don't rely on the community to take care of this for you. It will to a certain degree but this is something that the ownership can do to help reach your stated goals. 

 

 

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Random Thoughts:

I check Twins Daily...on a daily basis.  But I only check the blog portion sporadically, after (and if I have time) I've perused the forums.  As it is, I love TD just how it is, and am disheartened that it might not be sustainable.

 

I was a big fan of Grantland, and was delighted when The Ringer was started.  My nephew is in college and wants to write Ringer-style articles, and I asked him how in the hell the Ringer was paying for all those great writers, without any advertising.  I'll be honest--the writing, good as it was, seemed even better when it wasn't accompanied by a million ads.  And then, one day, ads appeared, almost like they had always been there.  Maybe they had been...tastefully done ads don't bother me that much, to be honest, but I can't stand many internet sites these days.  One pop up/auto-start video/slow load and I'm gone.

 

I use to write blog-posts for TwinkieTown, and enjoyed being paid in "recs". But then, the website was rearranged, and the prominence of the Fanposts suffered, and I quit taking the time to write.

 

I (and others, I'm sure,) have been asked to write game thread starters, both via the "open call" method as well as in a private message.  I'd do it, and do it for free, certainly, but the timing wasn't right.  Still, be persistent.

 

LAST, to all who have thought about writing but claim to not be good enough:  Just do it, and keep doing it.  Start, then take a break, then do it again.  If you can think, you can write.

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I live in Maine. I don't have access to any news about the Twins except what I read on Twins Daily. But I do live not far from Stephan King. So maybe I could write scary baseball stories? Like about the time the Twins were contracted and then redistributed among the wealthier teams? Sort of like a Republican tax plan applied to major league baseball...

 

I am intrigued by the idea someone had (I'm too lazy to go back and find the author) about the perspective of someone not living in Minnesota. Often times I'll be reading about the Red Sox (for New Englanders, there isn't any other team in the world by the way) and I'll think about how Twins fans would react in similar circumstances. I'll watch the articles more closely as spring training approaches and see if I can work up a theme. Now, as a retired Senior Citizen, I have to ask: would this be considered an article, a forum, or a blog? I just read this stuff. Everything is an article to me.

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To attract more writers create a writers section. In the section in the box in the upper right of the page. We have a twins forum, blog, articles and no writer development section. No info on how to structure a good post no call to action either. No way to contact anyone on how to get involved either or leave my contact for example if i was interested ...

I would also create links on the main page for those interested in writing click here to take them to the writers development section.

 

I'd be one who would be interested in an occasional contribution. But I don't consider myself to be any kind of baseball expert and my knowledge of the players around the league and in the Twins' system is not at the level of the main contributors, so I'm not sure what role I could fill.

 

I have on a couple of occasions started a thread in the forum section, but they have typically disappeared from the main page quickly as there were other forum entries getting comments and it appears that only the 5 or so more recently commented articles and forum posts stay there. That has discouraged me from using that forum (pun intended?) to share my thoughts. Maybe excluding articles that are already on the main page from the forum section would allow independent contributions that are presented there to flourish better?

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Hey everyone,

 

For those of you that don't know me, I write for Twinkie Town, a member of SB Nation and Vox Media. Twins Daily launched shortly after I joined Twinkie Town, and I attempted to write on both websites at the same time. I've expressed this to John in person, but my biggest issue was when I'd write a blog post that took a lot of time and effort and I was proud of my final result, yet it never saw the TD front page. It was disheartening, and after having that happen a couple times, I quit writing on TD because I knew all of my TT writing was guaranteed to be put on the front page. (For the record, I am not paid at TT so this was not a financial decision.) I still lurk on TD from time to time, reading any articles that look interesting from the TD Twitter feed. 

 

I feel that there needs to be a Twins Daily person devoted entirely to promoting articles from the blogs to the front page. Additionally, it might help if there is some way for that TD person to be notified every time a new blog post is submitted. It'll become overwhelming with enough new blog posts, but when that time comes, you'd just add on another person or two to review the incoming articles. I feel that this would be the easiest way to fix the main problem of struggling to organically develop writers. 

 

I agree Andrew. That was the intention, but we need to work on how to best implement it. 

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I have begun to write blogs this fall, just for fun because I have some off beat ideas I like to share with other baseball people.  I did not even know there was a financial reward - it was not my incentive.  I have published a lot in other areas - books, articles, etc, but sports is an interest and not my professional expertise. 

 

It took me a while to recognize how easy your blog space is to use and I have enjoyed putting up some essays.  Then I post those essay links on Facebook to entice friends to check them out.  

 

When it comes to forums I enjoy the give and take and discussions, but I do not see a lot of exchanges taking place in the blog sections.  The exchange of ideas is what makes the forum fun.  Maybe an article highlighting some blogs that people should check out would be good to direct people to the right hand side of the page.

 

The other fact is that most of us do not have the video access or the ability to check out all the minor leagues and we feel limited on what we have to contribute on a regular basis.

 

For me, the blogs (after a long delay) have been fun to post and I love checking out TD each morning.  I have no big ideas, but I do appreciate having your site  here.  

 

When we write a story, it automatically creates a forum post and links the comments to the forum post. I wonder if we could do something like that for blog posts. (And then link the comments from the blog post to the article when it is promoted.) Sounds daunting, but that would be ideal

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I read all the time, but wasn't really aware that you were soliciting writers. I knew some people occasionally tried their hand at it, but not that you were recruiting in the manner you describe. It might be worthwhile to have some regular calls for writers, or bring attention to how you intend to operate. As it's currently the end of the year, a "new writer of the year" award could be a post in which you draw attention to your process. Maybe have a vote like you often do for minor league player of the day. Highlight 5-10 new writers, provide links to their best or most viewed choices, and have the community vote on their choice. 

 

You could also provide a minimum payment for a first post ($25 if a post gets a minimum number of views) or later post (10th post with 100 views also gets $50) or something along those lines.

 

Lastly, perhaps you could offer a platform for people to pitch ideas to Twins Daily for posts, and offer feedback in advance? I think it's open for people to write, but you might have a lot of people that have an idea, but are nervous to try. If they have a closed proposal or submission option, they might make that step?

 

Also, somebody earlier suggested having new ongoing series - I think that's a really good idea. The daily minor league reports and monthly minor league awards are staples I always look forward to now. Even existing ones could target newer writers and specifically ask them to participate in those.

 

 

 

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I don't know if this is the right forum to bring this up... But one thing that's kind of frustrating is locking threads when someone "breaks" Twins news then a formal article is written an hour or 2 later about the topic.

I don't really want to repeat myself if I commented on a forum breaking the news. And sometimes there's good conversations happening that get locked because one of Seth, Tom, or whoever writes an article about it.

So maybe find a way to merge the forums together? I know there's been some frustrations in the past. Because like reporters, we all take pride in finding the scoop first.

 

Yes, we recognize this.  We just havent had any luck in figuring out a way around the software package for it. 

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This is probably the first time most of us have heard of the goal to grow the writer's community here. I think you just gotta get the word out.

 

As for "negativity" -- and this is a side point -- from my observations a small majority of the negativity in Twins Territory is a small group of people complaining about negativity. Our community is very meta.

 

TD does a good job of keeping the personal attacks down and unlike another Twins site the power here isn't abused by the mods to attack/bait people without consequences. I don't always agree with the mod decisions but I know they have a tough job and I can see the overall results are good.

When you do not like the tone of a site's community many move on.  You say meta, others have said haughty.   It is what it is. See the threads that draws the views and responses and the tone of the responses

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