Article: Twins To Sign Zach Duke, Maintaining Interest In Mike Napoli

[jud6312]

 

So far the front office does way too much hype and then ends up doing nothing. 

This.

 

At least with the old regime it was never really hinted/suggested/stated/etc. that something would be done before they did nothing. The expectations were low or non-existent, so we could be disappointed, but not surprised at their lack of moves.

 

I think it's at least been suggested that things are going to be different.

 

But so far the Wonder Twins' powers have activated to bring in a defensive-minded catcher whose defense took a step backward; a Rule 5 who was good enough to take up a roster spot for most of the season, but not good enough to stick in the end; a closer who's the human form of trying to stomp out a forest fire with a dried out Christmas tree; a "flamethrower" Rule 5 who is seemingly afraid of the strike zone; and an aging lefty who pitched OK in an injury-shortened 2017.

 

Who/what did I miss?

 

As someone said above, one or two of these types of signings is fine, but it's quickly becoming the norm.

 

I'm less offended by the Duke move, because he likely won't be in as high leverage positions as Rodney will. I just fear that if one or both of these guys falter, low financial  investment or not, they won't be able to pull the trigger on releasing or demoting them because they're too concerned about making their "signature" cheap move.

 

The only move that's made a ton of sense and strayed from the same old pattern is Pineda. Now, if they were to go do the same thing with Rosenthal, I'd be less concerned about these bullpen "upgrades" they've made this year.

[jud6312]

 

I'm with you being skeptical about the off-season so far. The difference I'm seeing for now is the new regime being more public about who they're "targeting" and interested in. The past regime was a steel trap, and us fans didn't know if they were ever in on free agents until they signed.

I guess it's not a bad thing to know who the Twins are trying to sign or trade for. But they'll learn quickly that fans will get sick of it too if the results are the same (not signing them).

The problem I see in "crediting" them on their transparency, is how do we know how strong the interest is?

 

When I needed to buy a new car, I was interested in a Mercedes - I looked in the windows, read about them on the internet, and even told my friends what I was interested in. The reality, however, is that while I was interested, I wasn't able to make it a reality and I basically knew that all along. I ended up with a used Chrysler instead.

 

In this offseason scenario, Darvish is the Benz, Duke the Chrysler, and Rodney the 1994 Toyota Carrolla with 486,227 miles on it that your Uncle Jeff can't stand to send to the scrap heap so it gets handed down from generation to generation forever.

[Thrylos]

Regarding Duke's 1.04 WHIP:  His BABIP was .196, which means that if it were league average his WHIP would normalize to 1.45 that is at the (replacement) level of his other numbers. 

 

Cannot really commend on the signing, before we have details of the contract type (MiLB, or MLB) and the amount.

Edited December 26, 2017 by Thrylos

[jud6312]

 

Regarding Duke's 1.04 WHIP:  His BABIP was .196, which means that if it were league average his WHIP would normalize to 1.45 that is at the (replacement) level of his other numbers. 

 

Cannot really commend on the signing, before we have details of the contract type (MiLB, or MLB) and the amount.

According to MLB Trade Rumors, via I Would Be Doogie, it's a big league contract, with the $1.5 to $2 million that's been thrown around. Maybe $1.5 base and another $500k in incentives?

[DaveW]

Finally a Craig Breslow replacement. Just like the trade deadline and last off-season, a strong effort by the front office to build a playoff team.

IALTO

[BJames]

First the Twins have a GOOD team now.  We need an Ace, First and by far the most important item missing.  I've never been to thrilled about singing a closer but we do need some help in the Pen.  May and others might be the answer. Next we could use a  RH bat, outfield DH a Vet. As far as DH, I saw stats that put Vargas 3rd best DH last year and Grossman right behind them.  Seems Power is the name of the Game right now and their are a lot of teams with guys hitting below .220 and striking out, for the occasional HR.  I don't get it, but I'm OK with Vargas. Let him Bat 4-5-6-7.  He's not great but we have a good line up and he can add a little power to it.  

[DaveW]

I'm with you being skeptical about the off-season so far. The difference I'm seeing for now is the new regime being more public about who they're "targeting" and interested in. The past regime was a steel trap, and us fans didn't know if they were ever in on free agents until they signed.

 

I guess it's not a bad thing to know who the Twins are trying to sign or trade for. But they'll learn quickly that fans will get sick of it too if the results are the same (not signing them).

Sports are a results business IMO. I don’t care that they ‘want’ an ace like Darvish, every team in baseball would ‘want’ Darvish under the right scenario.

 

Overall have yet to be impressed with any of the moves in the 12+ months the new FO has been here

[Thrylos]

 

Sports are a results business IMO. I don’t care that they ‘want’ an ace like Darvish, every team in baseball would ‘want’ Darvish under the right scenario.

Overall have yet to be impressed with any of the moves in the 12+ months the new FO has been here

 

Might not be impressed by their moves, but how about their results? Bit impressed there?

[drjim]

Not a sexy signing, but it's probably the right way to build a bullpen. Throw a bunch of numbers at it, don't get locked into multiple years for non-elite guys. I expect some minor league signings too.

 

The key is to use the saved resources for actual starting pitchers. As long as the starters remain unsigned I assume the Twins get one of them.

[Linus]

Might not be impressed by their moves, but how about their results? Bit impressed there?

Their results were due to improvement of a young core that the previous regime put together. Other than possibly Rowson they have done nothing and have screwed up a couple situations.

[Danchat]

 

Regarding Duke's 1.04 WHIP:  His BABIP was .196, which means that if it were league average his WHIP would normalize to 1.45 that is at the (replacement) level of his other numbers. 

 

Cannot really commend on the signing, before we have details of the contract type (MiLB, or MLB) and the amount.

Darren Wolfson is reporting it'll be between $1.5M - $2M. He'll likely be taking Buddy Boshers' roster spot.

 

I want to like the Levine/Falvey combo, but it's been a bit underwhelming thus far. I'll give them some credit - they're at least trying to sign the best FA starter, which is not something you could say for TR or Bill Smith. Just kinda wish they could have gotten somebody like Steve Cishek (2 years $12M) in over Duke and Rodney.

[gil4]

 

Dear FO,

 

Um....this isn't my ONLY X-mas present....is it?!

We want at least one Corvette. So far we just have a few Matchbox cars, mostly used with damaged parts.

[savvyspy]

You literally would have to work to find a more underwhelming guy to sign. It’s not 2014 and is it really THAT much to ask that every pitcher we sign isn’t coming off major arm surgery??? This FO is about a quarter step ahead of being Not Terry Ryan at this point. Not impressed.

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

Zach Duke. I don't see the upgrade over anyone currently fighting for a spot but I hope he works out.

 

I assume they will keep it stretched to an 8-man bullpen again, which I have as:

 

Rodney

Duke

Kinley

 

Rogers

Hildenberger

probably Busenitz

 

+2 more, out of

 

Moya, Pressly, Duffey, Hughes, Mejia (might start, though that is shaky).

 

That leaves 3 starting spots in the rotation to fill, 2 if you give Gibson a spot (likely).

[yarnivek1972]

I don’t see what Zach Duke brings to the table that Ryan O’Rourke (whom the Twins released) didn’t already have. “Experience”?

 

Translation: he’s old and likely due to regress. Sure, coming off TJS, O’Rourke is a bit unknown. But it would seem that a loogy role would be pretty easy to come back to after.

[Doomtints]

Signing Duke seems like another case of the Twins signing someone who dominated them in the past -- even if against other opponents they were not so dominant. It's hard to say how much this new FO is actually making these decisions, in fact it seems impossible that they are. This practice goes all the way back to Jim Thome, and we saw it already this offseason with signing Pineda.

 

Having said that, I don't have a problem with this signing... as accidental as it seems... Duke can contribute to this team.  

 

Hopefully the Twins can take things to the next level by, you know, signing someone who hasn't dominated their recent AAAA teams and actually do some scouting.

Edited December 27, 2017 by Doomtints

[DaveW]

Might not be impressed by their moves, but how about their results? Bit impressed there?

Same team Terry Ryan left them with, winning the wild card during a weak year was nice and it as no doubt a fun season bc they exceeded expectations, but it was clear they were NOT title contenders. Being the 10th or so best team in a 30 team league is a start..

 

As of today I would put their odds at the division at 10% and wild card at 25-30%

 

Too many other teams have improved this off season thus far. Gotta fix the pitching.

Edited December 27, 2017 by DaveW

[NDTimIrish]

Napoli would be a huge pickup. You can never have too many good clubhouse guys if you're interested in winning. 

[KirbyDome89]

 

Can't say I agree with the front office giving fans too much hype. Hype comes from the combination of ESPN/Social Media/Local Sports Writers & Insiders. Fans hear a rumor and run with the information, credible or not.  

Where else, other than the Twins, are those media outlets getting the information about which players the team is "targeting?"

[MidwestTwinsFan15]

 

Where else, other than the Twins, are those media outlets getting the information about which players the team is "targeting?"

Personally think that agents play a big part into delivering this information/rumors to the media to drive additional interest in their respective player(s). Scott Boras take this and runs with it to drive up the contract discussions. When more teams are interested - players value goes up!

[Tom Froemming]

 

Napoli would be a huge pickup. You can never have too many good clubhouse guys if you're interested in winning. 

He would boot either Robbie Grossman or Kennys Vargas off the roster. Are we sure those guys aren't good in the clubhouse?

 

I'm pretty sure I've seen Mike Berardino write positive things about Grossman being a good clubhouse guy. Vargas is the team barber and I would have to imagine he has strong bonds with fellow Puerto Rico products Berrios and Rosario. He also spent a lot of time in the minors with Sano, Buxton, Polanco and Kepler, so I would assume all those guys are bonded to some degree.

 

If you're signing Napoli to get a jerk off your roster, I'd be fine with that. And just to be clear, I am in no way qualified to speculate on who is/is not good in the clubhouse.

[jorgenswest]

I think he would boot both Grossman and Vargas off the roster. Vargas is still around because he had an option. Without that option, he would have been removed as soon as they needed the 13th pitcher.

 

This year they might start with a bench plus DH of Garver, Escobar, Adrianza, Napoli and Grossman (or Vargas). Who gets DFA’d when a 13th pitcher is needed?

 

They really need one player with options who can easily be moved to AAA when pitching is needed. The two best candidates are Granite and Garver.

 

If it is Garver, they would be counting on his bat helping against lefties playing a similar role as envisioned for Napoli. Resigning Gimenez would be part of this plan.

 

If it is Granite, a Napoli signing would be at the cost of Grossman and Vargas.

[DaveW]

Napoli would be such a terrible signing.

 

I’m not a huge fan of Grossman, but at least he can get on base and pretend to play defense if all things go pear shaped, Napoli is not a guy you need to bring in when you have Mauer, Sano etc who will need to be taking a decent number of at bats at the DH spot this year.

 

If Sano gets hurt, then you look at a mediocre DH like Napoli, not before though.

[KirbyDome89]

 

Personally think that agents play a big part into delivering this information/rumors to the media to drive additional interest in their respective player(s). Scott Boras take this and runs with it to drive up the contract discussions. When more teams are interested - players value goes up!

IMO the initial interest has to come from a team source. I can buy the idea that agents might overplay just how interested other teams are in order to gain some leverage, but I can't imagine any of them outright fabricating a team's interest in a client. Remember, those agents have to work with all 30 MLB teams, beyond just a singular transaction. I doubt organizations would be too happy if their name was linked to misleading "leaks." I also have a hard time seeing an organization being receptive to working with an agent adept at that practice. 

[Richie the Rally Goat]

I think he would boot both Grossman and Vargas off the roster. Vargas is still around because he had an option. Without that option, he would have been removed as soon as they needed the 13th pitcher.

 

This year they might start with a bench plus DH of Garver, Escobar, Adrianza, Napoli and Grossman (or Vargas). Who gets DFA’d when a 13th pitcher is needed?

 

They really need one player with options who can easily be moved to AAA when pitching is needed. The two best candidates are Granite and Garver.

 

If it is Garver, they would be counting on his bat helping against lefties playing a similar role as envisioned for Napoli. Resigning Gimenez would be part of this plan.

 

If it is Granite, a Napoli signing would be at the cost of Grossman and Vargas.

If Giminez the Napoli signing would be at the cost of Grossman and Vargas too, unless you’d release Escobar or Adrianza. I wanna see a left side of the infield of Napoli and Sano.

[notoriousgod71]

The Twins FO likely knew or had heard rumblings of Sano's situation so this could possibly be where the Napoli smoke is coming from.

[Doomtints]

 

The Twins FO likely knew or had heard rumblings of Sano's situation so this could possibly be where the Napoli smoke is coming from.

 

If this was a pattern, yeah. But it may not be a pattern. We'll know more as time goes on.

[Mike Sixel]

I agree that filling the team with guys you can't option is bad roster management. We've seen it with the bullpen, and other issues, over the years. Napoli makes no sense.