General politics

[PseudoSABR]

 

No, you are wrong.

I wouldn't mind if Omar took a hike though.

So you're in line with what happened at that rally last night? And you wonder why race is an issue? It's front and center as part of your boy Trump's campaign. 

[MMMordabito]

 

Where you see loudmouths I see very intelligent and articulate women, raising significant issues and not baloney. They remind me of my daughter, who gets things done assertively without being abrasive.

 

The rest of your post is too disgusting to dive into. You really should rethink your principles.

 

Typical smug liberal-speak.  

 

Some day and probably already for many of us middle-right (probably alt-right to any lib) folks, we'll get sick of supporting equal housing opportunities, equal education opportunities, equal employment opportunities, accountability in law enforcement, healthcare reform that benefits way more people than the current system as long as it makes sense, a women's right to choose, et. al, while still being talked down to or labeled a "racist" for not summarily judging someone for displaying the stars and bars or for having little patience for the blabberspeak of AOC and her crew.

 

When that happens, many will decide that this group over here is going to hate me and chastise me no matter what, while this group over here, while misguided, seems to be a bit more open and civil.

 

What's going to happen? Trump 2020

[howeda7]

 

So you're in line with what happened at that rally last night? And you wonder why race is an issue? It's front and center as part of your boy Trump's campaign. 

I like how he's now trying to walk it back. Asked why he didn't try to stop the chants he said he did and began talking very quickly. In reality he stood there for 13 seconds beaming at the chants. He thinks he can lie about things that are right there on video. Because he can. No one cares.

[ashbury]

Typical smug liberal-speak. 

All right, let me try a different way.

 

Imagine a white supremacist. They do exist, and some are intelligent and educated. Pick someone you know, or an imaginary one if not - someone realistic, but let's not quibble too much on the exact nature of the person - it's just a thought experiment - someone who has gone beyond just idle internet chatter and has joined a group or something.

 

Now suppose that person also has dabbled in the Men's Rights movement. He might bristle at being called anti-female, but he thinks that females are moving into areas that should be for males. Those people exist too, and the intersection of such leanings is hardly fanciful.

 

White supremacist. Men's Rights.

 

Imagine now showing that post to this guy. The one I was responding to. The post that highlighted words like 'ghettoized' and 'plantation', trivialized capable politicians as 'loudmouths, and calls attempts to address wrongs 'baloney'. Imagine him reading it.

 

Now: what part of that post would he disagree with?

[Badsmerf]

Typical smug liberal-speak.

 

Some day and probably already for many of us middle-right (probably alt-right to any lib) folks, we'll get sick of supporting equal housing opportunities, equal education opportunities, equal employment opportunities, accountability in law enforcement, healthcare reform that benefits way more people than the current system as long as it makes sense, a women's right to choose, et. al, while still being talked down to or labeled a "racist" for not summarily judging someone for displaying the stars and bars or for having little patience for the blabberspeak of AOC and her crew.

 

When that happens, many will decide that this group over here is going to hate me and chastise me no matter what, while this group over here, while misguided, seems to be a bit more open and civil.

 

What's going to happen? Trump 2020

Since when has the right wing supported any of that? Is the blabberspeak you're referring to regarding equal pay for women, standing up to corporations, advocating for gun control, and protecting the environment?

 

The minute these women of color were elected they were attacked. I don't have to agree with everything they want for our country, but when you belittle them instead of their arguments you lose credibility and are rightfully labeled.

 

If you or anyone else doesn't like being labeled, instead of being defensive, you should listen to why.

[PseudoSABR]

 

When that happens, many will decide that this group over here is going to hate me and chastise me no matter what, while this group over here, while misguided, seems to be a bit more open and civil.

Okay, so which group is more civil and open? The one at that rally last night? Is that what you're saying?

[gunnarthor]

 

Typical smug liberal-speak.  

 

Some day and probably already for many of us middle-right (probably alt-right to any lib) folks, we'll get sick of supporting equal housing opportunities, equal education opportunities, equal employment opportunities, accountability in law enforcement, healthcare reform that benefits way more people than the current system as long as it makes sense, a women's right to choose, et. al, while still being talked down to or labeled a "racist" for not summarily judging someone for displaying the stars and bars or for having little patience for the blabberspeak of AOC and her crew.

 

When that happens, many will decide that this group over here is going to hate me and chastise me no matter what, while this group over here, while misguided, seems to be a bit more open and civil.

 

What's going to happen? Trump 2020

Considering the mental gymnastics you seem willing to give *******s when they want to hide behind racist symbols, you seem to have hard time watching educated women of color speak out. I wonder what the difference is.

[Craig Arko]

He’s got a point.

 

[USMCTwin]

I've grown to distrust Washington democrats because they are all about their rhetoric. They have become a party that fronts up "race and gender inequalities" and it's nothing but patronizing baloney. They won't solve those issues in a million years. Any bankrupt ghettoized city in the US was been run by democrats forever. I find it refreshing when I see black conservatives dismantling democratic BS talking points. They've been used by the democrats since the 60s and it's good to see a lot of them leaving the democratic plantation.

 

My support of Trump has as much to do with (if not more), my disdain for what I'm seeing from the democrats. Most specifically that coterie of loudmouths known as "the squad"

Honest question. What was the goal here? If you were intending to foster discussion go after a certain position and explain why you don’t think it’s feasible or you disagree with it. If your intent was to rile them up, then carry on.

 

A couple of other things that bother me. It almost sounds as if you are saying most blacks don’t think for themselves. It’s offensive in the same way that some liberals insinuate the evangelical right don’t think for themselves. We can and should do better. Also referring to the Democratic Party as a plantation seems like the same ilk as calling detention facilities concentration camps. If you want to have a discussion here you will likely need to pick your words better. Otherwise you kind of kill the chance for discussion with your tone/style.

[ewen21]

It was a stand alone statement. It was simpy my stance on the Democratic Party as it is today. A number of posters gave their own interpretation of the Republican Party and I figured the door was open for me since no one felt the need to measure tone there. I don't see where the tone of my post was any more severe or accusatory as the some of the ones I saw. The bar had been set. I think AOC and Omar are borderline psychotic and if they both left congress today I'd love it. Omar is the one who couldn't understand why the US Army and Al Quiada are viewed differently by the American public. AOC is a freshman who is now going after her own party leader Nancy Pelosi. This business about "The Squad" is a joke. Is there no room for anyone to rip these jackasses? It's just a one way street, I suppose. Had I trashed the Republicans with even stronger words I never would have been called out. I don't know your story and you don't know mine (unless you've been lurking for the last four months). If you don't like my tone, but agree with what I'm saying in your heart of hearts, what are we actually talking about here? If you think these two freshman congresswomen are exceptional and worthy of praise then go on and give me your analysis. I'll read it

 

I'm on vacation right now and quite frankly I'm not as motivated to carry on with you guys like I was starting in March all the way into early June. I'm having too much fun right now to roll in the mud here. I'll be back in September. Wait for it

[USMCTwin]

It was a stand alone statement. It was simpy my stance on the Democratic Party as it is today. A number of posters gave their own interpretation of the Republican Party and I figured the door was open for me since no one felt the need to measure tone there. I don't see where the tone of my post was any more severe or accusatory as the some of the ones I saw. The bar had been set. I think AOC and Omar are borderline psychotic and if they both left congress today I'd love it. Omar is the one who couldn't understand why the US Army and Al Quiada are viewed differently by the American public. AOC is a freshman who is now going after her own party leader Nancy Pelosi. This business about "The Squad" is a joke. Is there no room for anyone to rip these jackasses? It's just a one way street, I suppose. Had I trashed the Republicans with even stronger words I never would have been called out. I don't know your story and you don't know mine (unless you've been lurking for the last four months). If you don't like my tone, but agree with what I'm saying in your heart of hearts, what are we actually talking about here? If you think these two freshman congresswomen are exceptional and worthy of praise then go on and give me your analysis. I'll read it

 

I'm on vacation right now and quite frankly I'm not as motivated to carry on with you guys like I was starting in March all the way into early June. I'm having too much fun right now to roll in the mud here. I'll be back in September. Wait for it

I understand you felt the tone was already set, but escalating wasn’t going to help your cause. In my experience when we soften our tone it causes others who disagree normally to soften theirs as well. Then discussions can happen. If we escalate you get the kind of responses you did.

 

I’m not a MN local (but I am here for the game tonight!) so I don’t see as much of the Omar stuff as you all do. If that statement regarding the military and al Qaeda is accurate then call her out on that and rightfully so. But to just say they are psychopathic there is nothing for people to discuss. It just comes off as an insult. I have been lurking/rarely posting for well over a couple of years. It’s one of the places I frequent to get a liberal slant to help keep me in balance.

 

I certainly was not trying to attack you or put you down. I am just trying to help have a discussion that doesn’t result to rolling in the mud. Enjoy your vacation! I always find it refreshing to use it as a reset from social media as well. Be well!

[ewen21]

Thanks for your response. Much the same as you I seek opposing views to challenge my positions. On Ilhan Omar and AOC there isn't anything that could reverse my opinion at this point. Being that criticisms here are openly given in great volume I feel obliged to do the same. When I do I'm always reminded that I'm not wanted and I'm OK with that

[PseudoSABR]

For those interested here's what Omar actually said about Al-Qaeda in 2013.  Basically, she was calling out a professor for using dog whistles through body language in her class.   At no point did she express pride in the group or diminish the US military.

[PseudoSABR]

 

 

 When I do I'm always reminded that I'm not wanted and I'm OK with that

You are welcome, but when you misconstrue facts, and vilify others, even public figures, without evidence you are going to get called out on it.  Getting called out on sloppiness and hatefulness doesn't mean you're not welcome.  Those who have done the same (being hateful and sloppy, not simply expressing a negative opinion) about the Republican party get called out too.

[ewen21]

For those interested here's what Omar actually said about Al-Qaeda in 2013. 

 

Basically, she was calling out a professor for using dog whistles through body language in her class.   At no point did she express pride in the group or diminish the US military.

I never said she diminished the military in any way, but her comments on the professor talking about Al Qaeda were made when she was in college. She was born in 1982 which means she wondered this close to the time 9/11 occurred. To wonder why Al Qaeda and the US Military illicited different feelings is shamefully ignorant. Maybe you don't feel that way but a rather large majority of Americans felt the same way about Al Qaeda as her professor.

So nothing is misconstrued about what she said:

[Vanimal46]

You may or may not care for Clay Travis. I enjoyed reading his thoughts about Trump's tweets.

 

https://www.outkickthecoverage.com/all-that-and-a-bag-of-mail-74/

[Badsmerf]

How can you watch that and not understand what she is trying to convey? The hypocrisy some people have about their own identities is staggering...

 

It is pretty obvious, she is taking about how these groups are used as examples in western culture to illicit fear for all Muslims. It isn't directly spoken, but implied. If you get something else out of that video, I hope you're never on a jury while I'm on trial.

[howeda7]

 

For those interested here's what Omar actually said about Al-Qaeda in 2013.  Basically, she was calling out a professor for using dog whistles through body language in her class.   At no point did she express pride in the group or diminish the US military.

If the right want to criticize "the Squad" politics that's fine. I don't agree with most of their political positions either. But instead they just pull quotes out of context and claim they're America hating radicals. There's no point in even in engaging the discussion. They're 4 members on the far left of one party. They don't have any real power. The GOP just needs a boogey-man and they're an easy target.

[PseudoSABR]

 

I never said she diminished the military in any way, but her comments on the professor talking about Al Qaeda were made when she was in college. She was born in 1982 which means she wondered this close to the time 9/11 occurred. To wonder why Al Qaeda and the US Military illicited different feelings is shamefully ignorant. Maybe you don't feel that way but a rather large majority of Americans felt the same way about Al Qaeda as her professor.
So nothing is misconstrued about what she said:

Thank you for the link. 

 

Not only does the youtube title miscontrue what she said and meant, you continue to do so. Did you watch the whole video? She's talking about something very complex--just after the 2:00 minute mark she makes the point that when terrorist commits a heinous act we investigate the whole community, but when a white person commits mass murder we investigate just that person and not the community at large. Her laughter is about the irony in the disparate treatment.

 

And she wasn't even talking about "reactions," she was talking about how the professor (and people generally) emphasize proper nouns when speaking about Islam and terrorism and mass murder.

 

I also don't believe this was filmed when she was in college; I'll believe the AP over that it was filmed in 2013. 

[Badsmerf]

You may or may not care for Clay Travis. I enjoyed reading his thoughts about Trump's tweets.

 

https://www.outkickthecoverage.com/all-that-and-a-bag-of-mail-74/

I agree with some points, disagree with others.

 

I do think people should be willing to stand up to being called racist... however I think these same people should be willing to listen and have conversations about it with willing participants. Sometimes an offensive statement was unintentional, sometimes it is an overreaction, but just standing up to calls of racism is arrogant and helps nothing.

 

Also, he states people whom criticize our country should spend a year overseas. The "america is so much better than Venezuela" argument is nothing less than ****ing stupid. How about spend a year in Germany? Or Sweden? Spend time in another wealthy nation with a high standard of living. I would argue, the ability to criticize our government is more fundamental than any other trait our country has.

 

This is only one instance of the countless we now have of Trump blowing dog whistles and stoking hate. He is who he is. There are tons of ways he could tweet his message to be more calculated and effective. That isn't week he is. He is a disgruntled bigot that isn't worth the time we give him.

[Vanimal46]

I agree with some points, disagree with others.

 

I do think people should be willing to stand up to being called racist... however I think these same people should be willing to listen and have conversations about it with willing participants. Sometimes an offensive statement was unintentional, sometimes it is an overreaction, but just standing up to calls of racism is arrogant and helps nothing.

 

Also, he states people whom criticize our country should spend a year overseas. The "america is so much better than Venezuela" argument is nothing less than ****ing stupid. How about spend a year in Germany? Or Sweden? Spend time in another wealthy nation with a high standard of living. I would argue, the ability to criticize our government is more fundamental than any other trait our country has.

 

This is only one instance of the countless we now have of Trump blowing dog whistles and stoking hate. He is who he is. There are tons of ways he could tweet his message to be more calculated and effective. That isn't week he is. He is a disgruntled bigot that isn't worth the time we give him.

All of this is fair. I agree with Clay's points that:

 

- Republicans should be fighting identity politics with ideas, not their own version of identity politics. It's valid to challenge the ideas of the 4 congresswomen he called out. But his communication is so piss poor, especially on Twitter, that caused the outrage.

 

- We should be thankful to be born and living in the US. For all of the country's faults and past history, this is still a great place to build a life.

[PseudoSABR]

 

You may or may not care for Clay Travis. I enjoyed reading his thoughts about Trump's tweets.

https://www.outkickthecoverage.com/all-that-and-a-bag-of-mail-74/

Pretty thoughtful, but I just have to call BS on this one quote from him:

That’s the part of Trump’s rhetoric that I agree with, in an era when everyone wants to focus on what America does imperfectly, Trump, rightly in my opinion, believes America is truly great

I've heard this sentiment from too many. Didn't Trump run on Making America Great Again, which implies that America isn't great.  And what has really changed since he's been elected beyond lower taxes and an unsettling immigration policy?  The right's sanctimony about patriotism drives me up the wall. 

[ewen21]

Thank you for the link. 

 

 

 

And she wasn't even talking about "reactions," she was talking about how the professor (and people generally) emphasize proper nouns when speaking about Islam and terrorism and mass murder.

 

I also don't believe this was filmed when she was in college; I'll believe the AP over that it was filmed in 2013.

 

In the first ten seconds she was laughing about how her professor REACTED when he mention Al Qaeda and Hezbollah. She did it again almost a minute in and stated that the words England, America and the Army didn't get the same treatment. As far as her explanation for this goes it's irrelevant.

 

As far as when this occurred I was not talking about the interview. Clearly that wasn't going to happen when she was a college student. I was (and she was) talking about when she was in college. She was 19 for the first semester of 2000 and that is when 9-11 happened. You have a habit of completely misunderstanding what's being said and then reinventing it. Please stop that or maybe instead ask for clarification.

[PseudoSABR]

 

In the first ten seconds she was laughing about how her professor REACTED when he mention Al Qaeda and Hezbollah. She did it again almost a minute in and stated that the words England, America and the Army didn't get the same treatment. As far as her explanation for this goes it's irrelevant.

Her explanation of what she was trying to say is irrelevant to what was said? So you're going to take her words out of context and twist them to mean something disparaging and then get offended by that? Okay then.

 

Surely, if she was supporter of Al Qaeda or wanted to diminish people's reactions to 9-11, there would be tons of evidence of this, and not clips from one video interview.

 

Do you think, one remote interview in 2013, warrants the talk from the president and his followers that she "should go back"? 

 

Also this: 

She graduated from North Dakota State University[19] with bachelor's degrees in political science and international studies in 2011

 

Who is doing the reinventing? I don't think it's me.

 

 

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

In the first ten seconds she was laughing about how her professor REACTED when he mention Al Qaeda and Hezbollah. She did it again almost a minute in and stated that the words England, America and the Army didn't get the same treatment. As far as her explanation for this goes it's irrelevant.

As far as when this occurred I was not talking about the interview. Clearly that wasn't going to happen when she was a college student. I was (and she was) talking about when she was in college. She was 19 for the first semester of 2000 and that is when 9-11 happened. You have a habit of completely misunderstanding what's being said and then reinventing it. Please stop that or maybe instead ask for clarification.

Can you clarify when 9-11 happened, again?

[ewen21]

She didn't take college courses AT ALL until she was in her mid 20s? That is minutiae in this discussion. Who really cares? Although this bit of information makes me wonder even more about her academic background. She graduated high school in 2000 and it took her 11 years to earn a batchelors degree. Not impressive.

 

As far as "context" goes I got all I need. Her explanation is nonsense to me. I need to go no further than the fact that she can't conceptualize her professor saying Al Qaeda the way he did as compared to how he says The Army. She also chuckled and smiled quite bit while talking about it.

[ewen21]

Can you clarify when 9-11 happened, again?

2001. Forgive me for confusing it with the year my dad passed away.

It's a thing for me. Maybe I'm not over it yet.

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

2001. Forgive me for confusing it with the year my dad passed away.

It's a thing for me. Maybe I'm not over it yet.

I can respect that.

[ewen21]

Not trying to be melodramatic. I've actually made this mistake a lot

[PseudoSABR]

 

She didn't take college courses AT ALL until she was in her mid 20s? That is minutiae in this discussion. Who really cares? Although this bit of information makes me wonder even more about her academic background. She graduated high school in 2000 and it took her 11 years to earn a batchelors degree. Not impressive.

Who knows what the reasons were that she waited to get her degree.  It's especially impressive for any one to go back to school as a non-traditional student and earn their degrees.  That you minimize her education demonstrates your out-sized bias here, and as such, it's pointless to discuss this further with you.