Article: Recap: Slegers Shines in Debut, Twins Split Doubleheader

[Tecmo]

Slegers is free!

[Dantes929]

 

I don't know, that's a routine fly ball for Buxton.

 

This is 0% on Buxton and 100% on Grossman for being an amateur. You have to know that's Buxton's ball and there's no reason to come flying in like a madman.

Nah, video shows Grossman sprinting to the ball and then slowed down quite a bit to be able to catch the ball handily just like Buxton did so the madman part wasn't really accurate.   It was in between the two and if Buxton saw Grossman could make the catch easily he might have just gone behind him as back up.   If he had done that and Grossman backed up also the ball falls and we talk about how bad both of them are.   After all Buxton could catch a lot of balls that Kepler and Rosario catch but it is in there territory and they don't have to run as far.   This was an in betweener and should be called for.    If Buxton did call it then it is the 100% fault of Grossman you said it was.     Do you really want your corner outfielders not going for the ball if they haven't been called off?

[ThejacKmp]

 

So much to say here - but first let me say that I like the idea of competing for the Wild Card and I think it is worth making decisions based on that, but not doing a trade.  With that said here is what I would like to see:

• Put Sleger in for Gibson.  If Kyle has not established that this is not his year I do not know what else needs to be done.  
• Bring up Gonsalves and put him in the fifth spot in the rotation.
• Tell Perkins it is nice that he is coming back, but we are trying to win something and this is not the time to lose that roster spot.
• Put together a real bench.  I think we will have Escobar at 3B and Sano at DH now, but I would like some power on the bench and I would have Vargas there and I would have Granite as the fourth outfielder.   As I have written elsewhere the defense has been the difference this year and the team ERA would shoot up to 5.33 if the defensive runs saved were the same as last year.
• Get Giminez off the roster and put Garver in and let him platoon with Castro.  Lets get over the love affair with Castros pitch framing - it has not made a difference - look at all the pitching stats.

For next year I am fine with Molitor but not his pitching coach.  Move on.

 

I like bringing up Gonsalves for Monday and seeing what he has. I'm not as big on bringing him up as 5th starter unless he really kicks butt Monday. He's only started one game in AAA. That's a big jump from AA to the majors and I'd like them to do right by him and his development.

 

The bench seems like a moo point since we're two weeks away from roster expansion. You'll get any of Garver, Granite, Palka, Byung Ho and Vargas up and have a fine and deep bench. We can complain about the last month but at this point, the bench is unlikely to be an issue. And I'm really hopeful for meaningful September ball - more so than most teams, I think the Twins will have a huge benefit from expanded rosters. We'll get some young guys up and our starting pitching is so bad that a few more relievers might be very nice. I wanna see some bullpen games!

 

Concur on Gibson and Sledgers. I'm not optimistic that Sledgers is going to be amazing because his stuff doesn't profile that way but he's at least an unknown. We know Gibson is Gibson.

 

Should have kept Perkins in minors until Sept 1. Then bring him up. Maybe he can get sore for 10 more days?

 

A platoon of Garver and Castro means Castro starts 7/10 games. Something no one thinks of when they recommend the platoon. I don't mind it to start because no one knows if Garver is ready for MLB and bringing him along slowly would be nice but long-term, that's not a great solution.

[ThejacKmp]

 

Nah, video shows Grossman sprinting to the ball and then slowed down quite a bit to be able to catch the ball handily just like Buxton did so the madman part wasn't really accurate.   It was in between the two and if Buxton saw Grossman could make the catch easily he might have just gone behind him as back up.   If he had done that and Grossman backed up also the ball falls and we talk about how bad both of them are.   After all Buxton could catch a lot of balls that Kepler and Rosario catch but it is in there territory and they don't have to run as far.   This was an in betweener and should be called for.    If Buxton did call it then it is the 100% fault of Grossman you said it was.     Do you really want your corner outfielders not going for the ball if they haven't been called off?

 

"Buxton said the two called for the ball at the same time and didn't hear each other." So not on Buxton.

 

I still think that a corner OF has to be aware of where the CF is and know that balls in that area are CF's and he should be backing it up.

[SarasotaBill]

When the rosters expand in September and the Twins are home you could start Gimenez and bat him ninth. When his turn comes up in the 2nd or 3rd you could pinch hit him and bring in Castro as the defensive replacement. You would still have Garver in case Castro gets hurt. 

 

I'm not sure at this time any bench players are that much better than Castro to use up two players for one at bat early in the game. More likely is a late inning PH for the catcher and defensive C substitution. 

[Circus Boy]

 

Went back and watched Slegers from inning 1 through 6. Very tall, downhill plane, throws like a shortstop with the ball cocked behind his ear, long stride gets on the hitter suddenly. Slegers has excellent control, and I expect it will get even better as he calms down on the mound. We didn't see much of his off-speed stuff tonight, but it looks like h delivers it with almost exactly the same motion as his fastball, making it very hard to read as the ball suddenly appears from behind his head. 

 

Though his fastball tops out at about 93, his forward release point and masking the ball behind his head cuts the hitter's recognition time down almost like he's throwing mid to upper 90s. If Slegers develops a good change, that could be a deadly strikeout pitch. As is, his control of the fastball keeps hitters from barreling it up, which is why he produces a lot of easy outs. That forward release gives hitters very little time to figure out what he's throwing. I saw a lot of emergency swings. 

Always enjoy your analysis, Mr. Jimbo. It's always fascinating how some pitchers get professional batsmen out, and others fail, and the differences between them.

[mikelink45]

 

Mostly agree even though bullet one and two are unlikely.   Slegers looked great but lets not forget SSS.  Agree most on Perkins.    I like the guy and all and hope he can make a come back but like I say about every one coming back from year long injuries, let him show success in the minors before just giving him a spot because he is deemed healthy. 

If he contributes next year then great but what do they really think he can do this year when his ERA in the minors is over 6.    

Why Escobar at 3rd instead of Sano?     I really like Granite and he is a logical permanent replacement for Grossman but I really wish he batted right with two of the regulars batting left.   Not likely that he will go in just as a defensive replacement but if you pinch hit for Kepler because of his splits against lefties it would use less players if a right handed 4th outfielder could go in for him.   Its why I always envisioned Hicks as having a lot of value for that.   Of course now he is showing I was wrong about him from the left side.

I said Escobar at 3B because I think Molitor really likes him.  When I see him continually in the 3 - 5 holes in the lineup I think it shows that Molitor wants him up as much as possible and now with Polanco back on the rise SS is not a place where he will get a lot of action.   I like Sano at third, but I think this fits with what I expect from Molitor. 

[Oldgoat_MN]

Gonsalves is not on the 40-man, so we are unlikely to see him in MLB this season.

The same is true of Park.

I would actually give Nik Turley another shot. Those minor league numbers are not a fabrication. Another MLB outing where he gets lit up might show that we really do not want to burn a spot on the 40-man roster over the winter. A strong and promising performance might make a difference in how we view our future potential starting rotation.

[Otto von Ballpark]

 

Gonsalves is not on the 40-man, so we are unlikely to see him in MLB this season.

The same is true of Park.

Gonsalves has to be added by November anyway, so if they can make room for him now, by moving Santiago to the 60-day DL or outrighting Recker or DFA'ing Boshers or whatever -- there is no real cost to promoting Gonsalves this season.

 

If they have an extra spot, they could certainly add Park back.  Worst case, he doesn't show anything and we can outright him off the roster again after the season.  I'm not sure if they'll bother, although Grossman being out presents a bit of an opportunity.

 

I agree Turley should get a look, but probably in a pen role at this point.  Maybe if we fall further out of the race, he could try starting again.

[oldguywithanitch]

 

Also, just had a thought.

 

When the Twins are on the road in September and rosters have expanded, could they have Vargas start at catcher and lead off the game and then after the Twins bat, immediately sub in Castro? Is there anything in the rulebooks that says you can't do this? I get why a team might not want to burn a position player with 25 man rosters but when they balloon, it gets an extra at bat for a better hitter.

 

It would also be interesting for an AL team in interleague or postseason play. They could get an at bat for their DH early in the game. You lose him as a pinch hitter but it seems like it might be worth it to for sure get a chance to use him rather than maybe get a chance later in the game.

 

 

I remember some road games in 1976 where a gimpy kneed Tony Oliva would be in the lineup batting lead off and playing 2nd base.  He would lead off the top of the 1st and be replaced by Bobby Randall or Jerry Terrell if he got on base or at 2nd base in the bottom of the first.  I found one boxscore:

https://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/TEX/TEX197604110.shtml

Edited August 18, 2017 by oldguywithanitch

[Dantes929]

 

I remember some road games in 1976 where a gimpy kneed Tony Oliva would be in the lineup batting lead off and playing 2nd base.  He would lead off the top of the 1st and be replaced by Bobby Randall or Jerry Terrell if he got on base or at 2nd base in the bottom of the first.  I found one boxscore:

https://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/TEX/TEX197604110.shtml

I could imagine scenarios where this might be a good idea... if Vargas was Tony Oliva.  Great find though!  

Edited August 18, 2017 by Dantes929

[Franz]

Given the present roster construction, I like Sano as the regular DH with Escobar at 3B. My reasoning is that even given Sano's recent "struggles", he is still the only middle-of-the-order-bopper on this team. I think most people agreed that when he missed a few games in early August due to the HBP's, the resulting lineup looked very weak. It's not that I think he is LIKELY to injure himself by playing 3B for the rest of the season, but the downside is so great and the Twins' margin for making the playoffs so slim that you need to do everything possible to keep Sano healthy.

 

For the bench I'd like to see both Granite and Garver brought up. Granite to provide pinch-running and outfield flexibility, and Garver to provide more positional flexibility along with a right-handed bat. Drop a pitcher off the roster for the next two weeks, and if the bullpen gets burned out again within the next two weeks somebody can ride the Rochester shuttle.

 

Apologies to Kennys Vargas. I feel like he just doesn't provide the consistent power to overcome his positional inflexibility. Anyway, we'll see him in September.

[Major League Ready]

 

I don't know, that's a routine fly ball for Buxton.

 

This is 0% on Buxton and 100% on Grossman for being an amateur. You have to know that's Buxton's ball and there's no reason to come flying in like a madman.

I don't know how you can possibly assign 100% to anything when you were not there.  Buxton is suppose to be the field general and it appeared he did not assert himself.  If he did not assert himself properly, at a minimum he contributed.  If he failed completely or called very late, he is the primary contributor to the collision given it is his role to control those plays.

 

We applaud Buxton's all out efforts but when Grossman does it he is a madman?  Seems like a double standard out just flat out extreme bias to me.

[ThejacKmp]

 

I don't know how you can possibly assign 100% to anything when you were not there.  Buxton is suppose to be the field general and it appeared he did not assert himself.  If he did not assert himself properly, at a minimum he contributed.  If he failed completely or called very late, he is the primary contributor to the collision given it is his role to control those plays.

 

We applaud Buxton's all out efforts but when Grossman does it he is a madman?  Seems like a double standard out just flat out extreme bias to me.

 

First of all, I don't know where you get the idea that we applaud Buxton's all out efforts. Most of TD says he needs to calm down and stay healthy.

 

I can absolutely assign blame on this one. That's a CFers ball. It's Grossman's job to know where Buxton is and to defer on balls he can generally get to. If I'm driving my car and go to take a right and someone coming the opposite way attempts to take a left at the same time and crashes into me, it is 100% their fault. That lane was mine and they deviated from the expected activity.

 

Grossman has nobody to blame but himself. It's his job to know that Buxton can get to that. It wasn't a borderline one either, Buxton wasn't going all out to get it, it was a routine fly ball. Buxton called he had it and that's all he needed to do.

[MN_ExPat]

1) Well you really wouldn't see it because he'd be yelling 

 

2.) That ball wasn't some in between one where either guy thinks he might have to get it. That is very clearly the CFers ball. He shouldn't have to call it at the MLB level.

A

 

... And that's precisely why he SHOULD be calling (screaming it actually) him off. That's Little League stuff, these guys are supposed to be pros. You ESPECIALLY need to be vocal at this level when even club footed outfielders (other TD readers words, not mine) can cover large amounts of ground. You see the results otherwise. That could be Buck on the DL, not the backup.

[bluechipper]

 

 

I agree Turley should get a look, but probably in a pen role at this point.  Maybe if we fall further out of the race, he could try starting again.

Turley is getting another shot, taking over for Boshers.

[yarnivek1972]

Also, just had a thought.

 

When the Twins are on the road in September and rosters have expanded, could they have Vargas start at catcher and lead off the game and then after the Twins bat, immediately sub in Castro? Is there anything in the rulebooks that says you can't do this? I get why a team might not want to burn a position player with 25 man rosters but when they balloon, it gets an extra at bat for a better hitter.

 

It would also be interesting for an AL team in interleague or postseason play. They could get an at bat for their DH early in the game. You lose him as a pinch hitter but it seems like it might be worth it to for sure get a chance to use him rather than maybe get a chance later in the game.

If I am not mistaken, Lou Gerhig maintained his streak this way at least once. I'm pretty sure he led off and started a game at shortstop on the road once. Of course, he never actually played shortstop. He was removed after his at bat. He had a bad back or something. I think I read about it in Olbermann and Patrick's book.