Your Interest in the NFL/Vikings

[Puckett34]

I used to love the Vikings/NFL way more than I ever did even the Twins until about 10-15 years ago.  Don't get me wrong, I still watch the Vikings most Sundays, but it's not must see for me anymore.  The new information on CTE's doesn't help.  But what did it most for me was the 2009 NFC championship game.  It helps, for myself anyway, that a Twins game is far more affordable to attend than a Vikings game.  Plus going to a ballpark is more fun to me than a football stadium.

[wsnydes]

 

That's another reason I can't keep watching.  I can't support those types of people - the abusers, rapists, etc.  I haven't watched an NBA game since Jordan retired from the Bulls for the last time.  

 

Hockey players, for all of their mullets and missing teeth, are generally some pretty upstanding guys.  I've been watching more hockey.

 

 

Before someone interprets that to be a racial thing, even basketball doesn't have nearly as many problems despite largely drawing from the same talent sources. Baseball sources its talent from all over the world, often at much younger ages in 3rd world countries, and doesn't have these pervasive problems either. There's something in the culture of football that allows these behaviors to persist and fester.

Good point.  By no means are my comments intended to be a statement on race.  An abuser is an abuser, a rapist a rapist, etc.  Race has nothing to do with that.

[drjim]

As a physician who has been on the sidelines for probably 12-15 games per year across the HS, college and professional levels for the past 10 years or so, I probably have a slightly different outlook on this than most. I agree with many posters that my enthusiasm for watching football on television has waned over the past few seasons, but that is difficult for me to tell if it is because I watch so much football already, or if my overall interest has decreased.

I enjoy being around the game and appreciate how hard these athletes work. I am constantly amazed at what people their size can do. I enjoy being able to help them when my services are needed. But I cringe every time a big collision happens. I dread that brief instant after a big hit when you aren't sure if the player is going to get up or not. I say a quick prayer before every game that no player will lose their life that night (which is crazy, right?). And when the clock hits 0:00, and no one has been hurt, I feel a huge sense of relief.

Inevitably, every fall when the stories about players dying from heat illness or traumatic injuries (and there are always a few, every year), I wonder if THIS is the year things really start to change. But damned if I know how to change things to make them safer. These are large, strong human beings running into each other at top speed. I don't know how you make that 'safe', by any definition.

I'm torn on this issue. I do think eventually, football as we know it will be no longer. How long? No idea, that's for people much smarter than me to figure out. But I can tell you: I have a young son. I hope like heck he picks up golf.

I appreciate this perspective thank you for sharing.

 

One thing I wonder from my playing days is the residual damage of the constant small collisions in practices and games rather than the big collusions. I was a tight end, so lots of blocking, lots of hitting heads with other bigger guys. I can't imagine that is good long term.

 

Do you have any insight into that? I do think teams are moving towards less contact in practice, which struck me as a long overdue move.

[Vanimal46]

 

I used to love the Vikings/NFL way more than I ever did even the Twins until about 10-15 years ago.  Don't get me wrong, I still watch the Vikings most Sundays, but it's not must see for me anymore.  The new information on CTE's doesn't help.  But what did it most for me was the 2009 NFC championship game.  It helps, for myself anyway, that a Twins game is far more affordable to attend than a Vikings game.  Plus going to a ballpark is more fun to me than a football stadium.

 

Good point. The last NFL game I went to was at the Metrodome 5+ years ago. The sheer amount of downtime waiting for the commercial breaks to end is incredibly boring. And, of course, you're going to have that one person in every section who's drunk and disorderly which can ruin the experience of a game. 

[Mike Sixel]

 

Good point. The last NFL game I went to was at the Metrodome 5+ years ago. The sheer amount of downtime waiting for the commercial breaks to end is incredibly boring. And, of course, you're going to have that one person in every section who's drunk and disorderly which can ruin the experience of a game. 

 

only 1? We had a mini family reunion at the Vikings Cards game last fall. We had 3 drunks, and people apologizing for their friends.

 

If not for there being 10 family members there, it would have been boring probably. But, modern stadiums and their huge screens help....

[Mike Sixel]

 

I appreciate this perspective thank you for sharing.

One thing I wonder from my playing days is the residual damage of the constant small collisions in practices and games rather than the big collusions. I was a tight end, so lots of blocking, lots of hitting heads with other bigger guys. I can't imagine that is good long term.

Do you have any insight into that? I do think teams are moving towards less contact in practice, which struck me as a long overdue move.

 

new research shows your fears of lots of "small" impacts (they aren't that small, actually) is bad.

 

Did anyone see Jim Plunkett's posts/news, and the response of fans taht "they are adults and got paid a lot"....so, ya, lack of good fans/empathy also is an issue for me. 

[drjim]

new research shows your fears of lots of "small" impacts (they aren't that small, actually) is bad.

 

Did anyone see Jim Plunkett's posts/news, and the response of fans taht "they are adults and got paid a lot"....so, ya, lack of good fans/empathy also is an issue for me.

I saw that research and recently had a talk with an orthopedic doc who downplayed the concern. Curious on other perspectives.

[nicksaviking]

My interest is also waning, but I still follow the Vikings. My low level of interest seems odd right now, maybe it will increase once the season starts. Maybe not.

 

It's much harder to have conversations with "NFL Only" types. I loved Vikings Journal (RIP) but posting there was an entirely different animal than in a baseball forum. Everyone speaks much more aggressively and cock-sure regardless if there is any evidence to support their opinions. When talking football there's rarely a distinction between opinion and fact and God forbid discourse is civil if there is a disagreement.

 

It's almost like NFL Only posters feel their posts have to be representative of what they see on the field.

[wsnydes]

 

My interest is also waning, but I still follow the Vikings. My low level of interest seems odd right now, maybe it will increase once the season starts. Maybe not.

 

It's much harder to have conversations with "NFL Only" types. I loved Vikings Journal (RIP) but posting there was an entirely different animal than in a baseball forum. Everyone speaks much more aggressively and cock-sure regardless if there is any evidence to support their opinions. When talking football there's rarely a distinction between opinion and fact and God forbid discourse is civil if there is a disagreement.

 

It's almost like NFL Only posters feel their posts have to be representative of what they see on the field.

This is my experience as well.  NFL diehards take the fun out of trash talking.  It goes past the point of friendly, good natured smack talk to just flat out mean and obnoxious.  It takes the fun right out of it.

[Mike Sixel]

 

I saw that research and recently had a talk with an orthopedic doc who downplayed the concern. Curious on other perspectives.

 

ah, thx! sometimes I forget your name starts with dr!

[Heezy1323]

 

I appreciate this perspective thank you for sharing.

One thing I wonder from my playing days is the residual damage of the constant small collisions in practices and games rather than the big collusions. I was a tight end, so lots of blocking, lots of hitting heads with other bigger guys. I can't imagine that is good long term.

Do you have any insight into that? I do think teams are moving towards less contact in practice, which struck me as a long overdue move.

I agree with you 100%. Certainly the big hits are more eye-catching, but the sum of the constant smaller collisions certainly isn't zero. I'm sure there is some threshold, below which the hits don't accumulate. But it's hard for me to believe that many hits that we would consider 'routine' don't somehow add up over time. There have been some college conferences that have put significant restrictions on contact in practice for that very reason (without doing some research I don't recall the exact details). I do think it is discussed less than it should be, for sure. In the same way that it's probably the cumulative effect of many punches that give boxers problems, rather than the 'knockout blows', it's likely similar for football players.

[Han Joelo]

Nice to know I'm not alone in dropping football.  I actually had a 30 minute conversation with myself (nonverbal!) about how to go about extracting myself from my family fantasy league without seeming like a holier-than-thou jerk.  Ironically, my brother and I played football, and were good at it, relatively speaking, for small town Idaho.  His kids don't play.  Mine barely know the sports exist; I feel bad when a friend asks them who their favorite team or player is.  Maybe that is part of it--it has consumed our culture to the point you worry about your kid having to be "uncool" because they don't know about it.

 

On the flipside, both of my sisters have let their boys play.  I've been to two games, and both times, the only good part was when the final whistle blew and they were unhurt.

 

I highly value what playing football did for me in Junior High/High School as far as a growth experience, but there are other ways for my boys to get that.  Even that is part of it--if they don't play youth league, they shouldn't even bother with Junior High.  Ridiculous.

[Vanimal46]

Leaving an established fantasy football league is always a tricky situation. Especially the leagues that reset every season, and seemingly has no stopping point. With some people in my fantasy football league it's the only reason we get back into communication now that we live thousands of miles away from each other. The last couple of years I think to myself this is the last year I'm doing this. And every year the "tradition" brings me back. It's the never ending cycle. 

[bighat]

 

 

 

The influence the officials can have over an outcome also drives me insane. Sometimes it seems like they call holding or pass interference whenever they feel like it. Sure, baseball umps can have a big impact on a game too, but not on that level.

 

THIS RIGHT HERE ^^^^

 

Every time an underdog is about to steal a road victory, Tom Brady or Aaron Rodgers are gifted with phantom pass interference calls.  If the underdog is on offense, they get a holding penalty and are forced to punt, etc. It just seems so rigged, and the same teams (Patriots) seem to get all the calls year after year. I stopped being a fan of the NBA as well for similar reasons, ie: phantom foul calls for superstars.  Stoppage of play also bugs the hell out of me, and I absolutely hate that they now blast "pump up the crowd music" during live play and pretty much during the entire experience. Football does that too now between almost every play.

 

The NFL and NBA have juvenilized the experience too much. They are aiming the product at 14 year-olds for marketing reasons. It's hard to watch a product that treats me like I have the attention span of a preteen. LOOK AT THIS - WOAH - KOOKY MASCOT - TERRIBLE TOWELS - LOOK OVER THERE - FIRST DOWN!!! - WE WILL ROCK YOU - BOOO - YAYYYYY....it's borderline unwatchable in many cases.

[Pardon My Dinger]

The NFL stands as a proud symbol of everything that's f-d up in the U.S. Right up there with the NCAA, the WWE, and the NRA.

 

If there was a 'spit' emoticon, I'd use it.

Could not agree more. I've been saying this (almost verbatim) for years now. It is a perfect sort of pageant for everything wrong with this country.

[Han Joelo]

Reading this thread cements what I like about the TD community.

[Deduno Abides]

Agree with all posts, particularly Arko's.

 

Would say that college football is worse.

 

1. Overpaid megalomaniac coaches.

2. Based on exploitation of young men.

3. Culture of exploiting young women.

[Mike Sixel]

 

Agree with all posts, particularly Arko's.

Would say that college football is worse.

1. Overpaid megalomaniac coaches.
2. Based on exploitation of young men.
3. Culture of exploiting young women.

 

Agreed.

[ashbury]

The 2009 NFC Championship game was the final straw

There was a perfect one-inch circular divot, the size of our youngest son's elbow tip, in the living room drywall from when he leaped up off the couch and swung his arms wildly when "the interception'" occurred. We left it there for several years until we repainted - it served as a reminder.

[Shaitan]

I watch all Vikings games, basically nothing else. Like the sport, hate the NFL business machine.

 

I refuse to watch NFL and talk about it with others, just alone. Which is why, I think, the real reason I still enjoy it is that I build in 3-4 hours of exclusive "me time" each week just to hole up in a quiet basement and block out the world.

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

My 12 year old self won't let me quit on the Vikings completely, but my rooting interest is more about seeing in what new ways the team will lose or end its season. I don't think the loss to Arizona in 03 or 04 gets the credit it deserves for pure shock value.

 

I also hate how football starts to suck the oxygen away from the other sports (baseball) this time of year. It's head shaking to watch MLB try to model itself after the NFL with replay, etc., but that's a whole 'nuther post

[D. Hocking]

 

I also hate how football starts to suck the oxygen away from the other sports (baseball) this time of year. It's head shaking to watch MLB try to model itself after the NFL with replay, etc., but that's a whole 'nuther post

 

I agree with Vanimal's original points, but I also like this statement above.  The NFL as an organization bothers me  in how they try to steam roll everything and Goodell acting like he is some omniscient leader who should never be questioned or defied.  It really bothered me how they hardballed Minneapolis into giving them a tax exemption in order to host the Super Bowl (not that they could not have simply said -forget it).  Everything is about milking out every penny they can, and then pretending they care when something goes wrong.  Their non-profit status is a whole other story.

 

I do still watch the Vikings partly out of habit and family tradition.  It does get harder with the health concerns for the players, the greed and hubris of the organization, and them games not being as enjoyable to watch.

[Craig Arko]

 

The NFL as an organization bothers me  in how they try to steam roll everything and Goodell acting like he is some omniscient leader who should never be questioned or defied.

 

This vaguely reminds me of someone else.

[TNTwinsFan]

For me I am a Twins Fan (and havng out here almost all day, every day) and a Nashville Predators fan. Beyond that I wouldn't even really notice if the NFL or the NBA folded up shop. I abhor watching Sports Center and don't have the time nor the tolerance for Fantasy Sports. Between the Twins and the Preds I pretty much have something to watch all year long. Oh...and at least in Hockey they can fight like men, go to time out, then, get back at it. A HELL of a lot more action on the ice than on the football field.

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

The NFL as an organization bothers me  in how they try to steam roll everything and Goodell acting like he is some omniscient leader who should never be questioned or defied

and when Roger Goodell tried to start a war with the New England Patriots, it backfired spectacularly

[jkcarew]

Many of these posts come across as tinged with jealously and envy.  Maybe to be expected from a baseball blogging site frequented by hard core, sophisticated baseball fans.  I don't look at it this way.  I think football is simply different that baseball.  I also think football at a youth or high-school level is totally different than football at the professional level.  I love both football and baseball.  I see them as different and they appeal to different aspects of what I think athletes and competitors can be.

 

I would say I follow baseball much more than football at the professional level, and my relative interest in the Twins and Vikings reflects that.  I would say I'm just weary of the NFL...the game atmosphere, fan behavior, the way the game is marketed, etc.  But I also think those of us that feel this way will be in the minority yet for a long, long time.  But at the youth and college levels I follow football more closely.

 

As for the injury risk regard football...particularly the risk for youth and high school players, I couldn't disagree more with many of the posts here.  If you think football is dangerous for your youth or high school player, you've been falling prey to bad and incomplete information.  As the undisputed top dog, football has taken on the role of cultural bully in this time of incessant political correctness.  Otherwise rational people are swallowing every bit of news regarding concussions as apocalyptic.  Meanwhile, anything published that puts these risks in realistic context never seems to see the light of day.  No sport, or physical activity, for that matter, is without risk...including risk of catastrophic injury.  The benefits outweigh the risk, and the equation is not significantly different for youth football.  If your kid is good at it, and/or if your kids simply likes it...let him play youth or high school football!  It's the one remaining sport that coaches and scouts don't expect the kid to play all year.  Let him play college football!  If he finds himself in the NFL and facing a decade of collisions with guys that weigh 240 lbs and run 4.6 40's, then he'll have a decision to make.

 

Full disclosure:  I played football through college.  I have two boys.  One is playing college football now, the other never liked playing much and quit early on during his youth years.  Both played baseball through high school.  Also, I took my mother to game seven of the '87 series.  That probably reveals more than I want regarding my age...and it has absolutely nothing to do with the topic.  I just like remembering it and saying it...I took my mother to game seven of the '87 world series.

 

[Craig Arko]

More of you should attend the ballet and see real athletes in action.

[ashbury]

More of you should attend the ballet and see real athletes in action.

I thought that's what we were watching in right field.

[Ben B]

I didn't grow up a football fan. Got moderately into it in my 20s when Peterson broke out and paid attention to the Vikings for a few years. Agree with all the posts about concussion issues, domestic violence, NFL being a horrible organization, etc. 

 

One thing though, is the games are absolutely BRUTAL to watch. Snap the ball, action for 3 seconds, time out. Commercial. Another snap, action for 3 more seconds! Oh wait, a flag. Time out. Commercial. Rinse and repeat. I know baseball has some similar pacing problems, so maybe I'm just used to it in baseball. 

 

I also noticed, just in the short time I was watching games, they started cutting the camera away extremely quickly when a guy got injured. Like they were trying to hide the fact that the sport is violent. 

[PDX Twin]

I'm late to this thread, but want to echo the comments of many others.

 

I was a huge football/Vikings fan for as long as I can remember. My family went to our lake cottage in order to get some snowy reception for the 1958 championship game between the Colts and the Giants because we could get that network in town. Great game! I was hooked!

 

There was no particular event that caused me to lose interest in American football. Rather a series of things that got more and more distasteful to me over time.

 

The biggest one is the enormous amount of "downtime" in the game. Every five seconds of action are followed by a 30-second meeting, if not two minutes of commercials. (Someone characterized it as the quintessential American sport: extreme violence and endless meetings.) In comparison, the (some call it boring) steady pace of 45 uninterrupted minutes in *real* football (the kind played with the feet) is both riveting and relaxing at the same time. And I can step out (or fast forward) for halftime and not have to watch a single commercial!

 

Also, the incessant, individual-motivated hot-dogging has always bugged me in any sport. In American football (and basketball, which I also avoid) there seems to be much more "look what I did" celebration than "Wow, we won the game" celebration. I'm totally cool with the latter, but disgusted by the former, even in baseball (e.g., when a hitter celebrates after a homerun in a 10-2 game. There's a lot of celebration in European football, of course, but in such a low-scoring game nearly every goal is a potential game-changer.

 

The concussions and off-field behavior also play a part for me. But there are people behaving badly in every sport (our own Kirby, for example) and, of course, Twins fans are only too aware that concussions occur on the diamond as well.

 

All told, it just made sense a few years back to simply stop watching. I fill my fall with live college soccer and "the beautiful game" from Europe on cable. Haven't missed "pointy ball" at all!