Article: Dozier's Disastrous Rookie Season

[Nick Nelson]

You can view the page at http://www.twinsdaily.com/content.php?924-Dozier-s-Disastrous-Rookie-Season

[glunn]

Interesting article!

 

I think that sending him down and giving Florimon a chance makes a lot of sense. Dozier might be able to better relax and improve his game at AAA, and I look forward to seeing Florimon's defense.

[Seth Stohs]

My only point would have been that sending him down a month ago would have made sense. Like Nick pointed out, there's just 2 1/2 weeks left at Rochester. Florimon is intriguing. I'm intrigued by his glove. We know he's not likely to hit a lot, but if he can be a plus-plus defensive shortstop, what happens?

[twinswon1991]

I dont know that I would classify it as a disaster but more of this is who he is. Dozier is too old to be considered a decent prospect and the org rankings everywhere reflected that. Dozier has a chance to be a fair utility guy at best which has value. Levi Michael is a similar "too old for his level" guy with utility upside but at least the Twins didnt waste a first rounder on Dozier.

[diehardtwinsfan]

I think Nick is being a bit negative here. Baseball is littered with examples of people who didn't make it their first time around, and given that Dozier was hardly considered a big prospect, it's not surprising that he struggled. I do think he needs to earn his spot next year, but given his age, it isn't wise to write him off as a bust either. Let's see how he handles Rochester and how he does during his second stint before we call him a bust.

[Brock Beauchamp]

I don't get it. If they thought this was necessary, it seems like the latest the move should have been made is August 1st. Doing it now doesn't make much sense.

[twinsnorth49]

Very odd timing for sure, would like to see him get some reps at 2b when he's called back up. Too early in my mind to start throwing in the towel on him.

[SeanS7921]

His defense at short wasn't that bad, errors aren't a great stat to go by. His UZR was right around 0 with over 700+ innings. I don't get why he never took pitches or seemed to take coaching direction though. If he could have taken 15 more walks and worked the count he would have had on OBP of 315 or so. That would be adequate with his defense. He made a lot of dumb plays in the field but I think you could chalk that up to being a rookie. But yeah in reality he didn't seem to care to not be Delmon Young at the plate and he is pretty old to suck that bad.

[jimbo92107]

Brian Dozier desperately needs some time away from the pressure of mlb ball, nothing to do with age, he's just emotionally fried right now. His hitting has been sporadic, his batting stance, mechanics and mental approach need work. He's also getting dangerously tentative at SS. In other words, he's starting to look like Nisihioka.

 

Meanwhile, Pedro Florimon is hitting well enough to give him a look. Florimon's fielding reportedly is superb. Plug him in at short and don't worry. If Florimon shows he isn't overmatched at the plate, he could be next year's starting SS, maybe with Dozier at 2B.

 

Two weeks is a short time, but Dozier needs a break from the pressure to regroup and get his form back. Maybe it's enough for the kid to relax. Personally I think he can be a solid major leaguer. I don't know why we worry so much about this over or under 25 stuff. If we decided everything on that, we would have missed Denard Span, Torii Hunter, and Sam Deduno.

[minn55441]

I don't get it. If they thought this was necessary, it seems like the latest the move should have been made is August 1st. Doing it now doesn't make much sense.

 

I agree, but I think a lot of the timing had to do with the fact that Plouffe was on the DL and they still wanted to give Nishi a shot. They didn't want to field an entirely new Middle infield. Now that Plouffe is back, Nishi's chance has come and gone they can get on with letting some of the other things play out.

 

For me it comes down to "what do you want from your middle infielders"? Defense has to come first with this team. Let the other positions carry the offensive load. Granted we can't have a .190 hitter at short, but if we can get above average fielding at SS I can live with a .245 hitter with little power.

[Thrylos]

For me it comes down to "what do you want from your middle infielders"? Defense has to come first with this team. Let the other positions carry the offensive load. Granted we can't have a .190 hitter at short, but if we can get above average fielding at SS I can live with a .245 hitter with little power.

 

 

Agree. That's why I see no reason that the best defensive middle IF in this team (Casilla) should not be playing every day.

 

I think the Dozier demotion might be to help him get down there, work with Brunanksy and build his confidence up. Also, auditioning Florimon makes sense because they would need to make some decisions for next season. Pretty excited to see a Florimon/Casilla DP combination, but I am not sure that is happening. Carroll was pretty atrocious at SS last night

[Winston Smith]

Who was the last infielder that came up thru the system that actually stuck and played quality baseball for several years?

From the lat 90' to 2004 Rivas, Guzman, Koskie and Minty played together and were solid by all accounts. From that time nobody has had an extended amount of solid play other than Morneau. Doesn't that really say a lot about the drafting and scouting this team has?

[Mr. Ed]

yet no mention on Carroll's D last night in the postgame stuff. He's no longer a SS, but will likely command too many innings there.

 

Lowered expectations with this team. Slug hitters in the middle is ok as long as they can play D.

 

Shows what happens when the talent pool is thin.

[Mr. Ed]

Who was the last infielder that came up thru the system that actually stuck and played quality baseball for several years?

From the lat 90' to 2004 Rivas, Guzman, Koskie and Minty played together and were solid by all accounts. From that time nobody has had an extended amount of solid play other than Morneau. Doesn't that really say a lot about the drafting and scouting this team has?

 

Absolutely. Same applies to pitching. They've done quite lousy overall of late.

[cr9617]

We shouldn't be surprised by his struggles. One good season in the minors doesn't really mean all that much. Our media here talked him up like he was the next big thing. He's not.

He looks like a utility guy to me.

[savvyspy]

Just another example of the rudderless Twins front office chasing this fantasy that "there are no scholarships". That obviously only pertains to rookies who they feel the need to humiliate publicly to mask the fact that they have no plan and can't manage a roster. So its totally fine to trot Blackburn and Deunsing out there but you are drawing the line with Dozier??? That's ridiculous. Especially since you have NO ONE to replace him because you refuse to sign productive free agent or trade at the deadline to make your team better. The only thing guaranteed by this move is Florimon won't come close to batting .230 and isn't going to be an upgrade by really the only statistic that matters, wins. This isn't Dozier's fault. This is purely an organizational failure.

[greengoblinrulz]

Bascially the Twins are saying that Joe Vavra can do nothing with Dozier & they need Brunansky to work with him for a couple wks.

Remember how horrible Ben Revere was at the plate last yr....sometimes it takes an offseason for everything to sink in

Dont know if they wanted to waste an option year tho....

[CDog]

Just another example of the rudderless Twins front office chasing this fantasy that "there are no scholarships". That obviously only pertains to rookies who they feel the need to humiliate publicly to mask the fact that they have no plan and can't manage a roster. So its totally fine to trot Blackburn and Deunsing out there but you are drawing the line with Dozier??? That's ridiculous. Especially since you have NO ONE to replace him because you refuse to sign productive free agent or trade at the deadline to make your team better. The only thing guaranteed by this move is Florimon won't come close to batting .230 and isn't going to be an upgrade by really the only statistic that matters, wins. This isn't Dozier's fault. This is purely an organizational failure.

 

How in the world is it publicly humiliating a guy to send him down to the minors after he struggles for months on end? Once he comes up, he has to stay forever? Don't look now, but that's the problem you're ranting against.

 

Over and over and over they've supported Dozier, said they think he can be a good major league shortstop, given him time and experience to grow and improve, and talked positively even about his mistakes. My goodness. StarTrib comment section is just down the street.

[nicksaviking]

So the Twins trade for the division leading White Sox's utility infielder and the Twins' system is so much better that he can't even beat Pedro Florimon to Target Field?

[stringer bell]

I thought a lot of Dozier's at-bats left something to be desired. Swinging early at pitcher's pitches, making a lot of soft contact, and a poor K/BB ratio. That said, I thought his defense had stabilized as acceptable and that he was playing fairly sound fundamental baseball.

 

I didn't witness the extra inning play that seemed to ignite conflict, but seldom has a Twins player been criticized for taking a sure out.

[Rosterman]

Why not just keep Toshi as the reserve. We need the 40-man spot, two guys coming off the 60-day shortly which means two players have to be designated for assignment or waived.

[CDog]

I didn't witness the extra inning play that seemed to ignite conflict, but seldom has a Twins player been criticized for taking a sure out.

 

I think too much has been made of that one play simply because it was the last thing he did, essentially. In live action, both my friend and I at the game thought he had no play other than the one he made (contrary to common belief, sitting in the stands isn't always/often the best vantage point to tell those things). The guy next to us thought he should have tried to start the double-play. When I caught the re-airing later, I thought he should have gone home. Even there, Blyleven thought one thing initially and then with the help of replay after the pitching change thought maybe something else (I forget which was his first and which was his subsequent reaction). Gardenhire has said in a bunch of outlets (although he may have only said it once and it was just reported several) that he liked Dozier's thoughts and process and only thought that in that very specific game situation that he maybe should have made a different choice (and had to go to video to show him what he meant and used it as a teachable moment). He also pointed out that Dozier was the one out in the fire and that the information he had wasn't the same as what someone watching might have. I'm rambling, but the point is, I don't think that play had much to do with any decisions on Dozier.

[twinsnorth49]

Just another example of the rudderless Twins front office chasing this fantasy that "there are no scholarships". That obviously only pertains to rookies who they feel the need to humiliate publicly to mask the fact that they have no plan and can't manage a roster. So its totally fine to trot Blackburn and Deunsing out there but you are drawing the line with Dozier??? That's ridiculous. Especially since you have NO ONE to replace him because you refuse to sign productive free agent or trade at the deadline to make your team better. The only thing guaranteed by this move is Florimon won't come close to batting .230 and isn't going to be an upgrade by really the only statistic that matters, wins. This isn't Dozier's fault. This is purely an organizational failure.

 

Well I agree partly with the Blackie part, although he got sent down at one point this year as well, was that to humiliate him? Duensing is only starting (which he shouldn't be) because Pavano is a mess and Hendriks is working on his super-duper Tilt-a Whirl pitch before he gets called back up. With all the other gaping holes this team had to fill last off-season and cut payroll, what were they to spend on a free agent MI other than Carroll or who were they going to give up on in trade?

 

I don't see Dozier's demotion as a humiliation, it should have come earlier but's it not designed to embarrass him, plus at this point I really don't think it needs to be something we sell our soul to fill for next year.

[diehardtwinsfan]

not quite sure why teh FO/Gardy is getting heat here. My complaint with Gardy in particular is that he never lets rookies work through things... he did exactly that with Dozier. I do think he should have gone down a bit sooner, but injuries might have forced that a bit... Hopefully teh kid can put things back together in Rochester and force his way on to the team next season.

[ossieO]

I don't get it. If they thought this was necessary, it seems like the latest the move should have been made is August 1st. Doing it now doesn't make much sense.

 

I agree, but I think a lot of the timing had to do with the fact that Plouffe was on the DL and they still wanted to give Nishi a shot. They didn't want to field an entirely new Middle infield. Now that Plouffe is back, Nishi's chance has come and gone they can get on with letting some of the other things play out.

 

For me it comes down to "what do you want from your middle infielders"? Defense has to come first with this team. Let the other positions carry the offensive load. Granted we can't have a .190 hitter at short, but if we can get above average fielding at SS I can live with a .245 hitter with little power.

 

I agree Plouffe's DL stint was probably a factor. I also think Florimon was on the DL recently, so there was perhaps a lack of options when thinking about a Dozier demotion.

[DAM DC Twins Fans]

Why not just keep Toshi as the reserve. We need the 40-man spot, two guys coming off the 60-day shortly which means two players have to be designated for assignment or waived.

 

Good point--dont Hicks and Arcia have to be added this winter too??

 

I do not understand timing--2 weeks in Rochester will not do much...

 

This all goes back to the Delmon trade...we wouldnt be having this discussion if Jason Bartlett was still here.

[108 Double Stitches]

My guess its a message -- don't get too comfortable. And Dozier' level of production isn't enough in the long run.

 

I was kind of comformtablely numb with Dozier's play. Low expectations and bigger problems elsewhere on the roster. Even if you can't expect much skill improvement in 2 weeks, maybe an attitude or wake up call can be made. A little reminder that come spring training, ss will at the very least be an open competition.0

[SeanS7921]

yet no mention on Carroll's D last night in the postgame stuff. He's no longer a SS, but will likely command too many innings there.

 

Lowered expectations with this team. Slug hitters in the middle is ok as long as they can play D.

 

Shows what happens when the talent pool is thin.

 

Carroll just missed a great play early in the game and had a crazy hop that was hardly his fault. If you look at advanced stats he has been exceptional at SS, great at 3B and awesome at 2B. The guy can flat out field.

[Thrylos]

we wouldnt be having this discussion if Jason Bartlett was still here.

 

he hit .133/.240/.193 in a month for the Padres this season, after hitting .245/.308/.307 last season, and has been on the DL since mid May... not much of a solution at this point. He is 32, been hurt multiple times and past his prime

[Curt]

I would not call Dozier's season a disaster but he has played poorly. He certainly has not played well enough to warrant a starting position in the major leagues or even a roster spot and it makes sense to give someone else a shot.

 

I'm glad he got a chance and I hoped he would succeed. I still would like that. If Dozier has what it takes, he'll be back. He might just stick then. If the Twins have anyone in their org who will lock onto the starting shortstop position and hold it they are doing a good job of keeping it a secret.

 

The Twins are not punishing Dozier. It's tough to earn a major league job and the competition for it should be fierce.