Dozier Trade Discussion Thread

[twins_89]

 

Man I'm just really really happy Falvey and co are in charge of this trade. I fear to think what we would settle for if the old guard was still around.

 

With the old guard there probably wouldn't be a trade. One of my biggest complaints with the previous front office was they seemed to always hold onto players well past the optimal trade window. 

[diehardtwinsfan]

 

Man I'm just really really happy Falvey and co are in charge of this trade. I fear to think what we would settle for if the old guard was still around.

 

Not on this issue.  TR was a pretty stingy guy... and had a bit of a rep there in terms of what he wanted. 

[Vanimal46]

With the old guard there probably wouldn't be a trade. One of my biggest complaints with the previous front office was they seemed to always hold onto players well past the optimal trade window.

Cart before the horse. No trade has happened. The very same thing could happen with the new regime.

[AZTwin]

Cart before the horse. No trade has happened. The very same thing could happen with the new regime.

You don't make a trade just to make a trade. There has to be a willing party. If you just get offers for AAAA guys, it just doesn't make sense.

[King]

http://www.fanragsports.com/mlb/heyman-dodgers-twins-standstill-dozier-trade-talks/

 

Heyman reporting what Dave has been saying since after the 24 hours were up. Though Dave is saying that the team has agreed to JDL/Alvarez and balking on the 3rd and 4th pieces. Heyman reporting they have agreed to JDL and the Dodgers are balking on Alvarez/Buehler as the 2nd piece.

 

I have a hard time believing that the Dodgers would balk on Buehler or Alvarez as the 2nd piece of the deal. Dozier just put up a 6 fWAR season and is being paid on the cheap for the next 2 years at a position they need. 

[mazeville]

 

http://www.fanragsports.com/mlb/heyman-dodgers-twins-standstill-dozier-trade-talks/

 

Heyman reporting what Dave has been saying since after the 24 hours were up

 

Saw this. 

 

Also interesting that Twins are making plans for Dozier to attend TwinsFest. 

 

I have to admit that I'd be disappointed to see Dozier in a Twins uniform. I get it that I'd really like the Twins to get a good return for him, and certainly don't want him to fetch a weak return. But I'm convinced that they're not going to contend without a further infusion of young talent and do not believe Dozier will be here beyond his current contract.

 

This team also needs pitching like nobody's business. 

[King]

 

Saw this. 

 

Also interesting that Twins are making plans for Dozier to attend TwinsFest. 

 

I have to admit that I'd be disappointed to see Dozier in a Twins uniform. I get it that I'd really like the Twins to get a good return for him, and certainly don't want him to fetch a weak return. But I'm convinced that they're not going to contend without a further infusion of young talent and do not believe Dozier will be here beyond his current contract.

 

This team also needs pitching like nobody's business. 

 

It's 100% the right time to trade Dozier. Value will be only going down as his years of control diminishes, and if they start this coming season with him they risk that he has a down season or gets injured and tanks his value. 

[mazeville]

 

It's 100% the right time to trade Dozier. Value will be only going down as his years of control diminishes, and if they start this coming season with him they risk that he has a down season or gets injured and tanks his value. 

 

There's also the prospect that he has a garbage first half. 

 

To me, you trade him this offseason. And nobody has the prospects and the need the Dodgers have. Seems to me like the Twins are playing hardball and the Dodgers are trying to come to terms with what they have to give up to get him.

[jimmer]

 

http://www.fanragsports.com/mlb/heyman-dodgers-twins-standstill-dozier-trade-talks/

 

Heyman reporting what Dave has been saying since after the 24 hours were up. Though Dave is saying that the team has agreed to JDL/Alvarez and balking on the 3rd and 4th pieces. Heyman reporting they have agreed to JDL and the Dodgers are balking on Alvarez/Buehler as the 2nd piece.

 

I have a hard time believing that the Dodgers would balk on Buehler or Alvarez as the 2nd piece of the deal. Dozier just put up a 6 fWAR season and is being paid on the cheap for the next 2 years at a position they need. 

I have Buehler and Alvarez higher than De Leon too and I absolutely believe they'd balk at putting either in their as a second piece.  12 controlled years of highly regarded prospects for two years of a 2B who turned 30 (at a very good price).  I don't think it matters what his WAR was this year so much. More to do with how he's expected to play in the future (and for only two more years). Friedman and Company understand that.

[gunnarthor]

Heyman is saying the Twins don't feel any urgency to get the trade done, which makes sense for us.  There really is no reason to trade Dozier for a package that won't actually improve the Twins.  De Leon and Calhoun, for example, probably don't.  

[doscinco]

What about Jorge Polanco for De Leon?

[Cory Engelhardt]

 

What about Jorge Polanco for De Leon?

 

As a rebuilding team, why would you trade a young player with years of control instead of a player in their 30's with only 2 years of control left?

[gunnarthor]

 

What about Jorge Polanco for De Leon?

If Dodgers would take that, we'd be all over it.  

[King]

 

I have Buehler and Alvarez higher than De Leon too and I absolutely believe they'd balk at putting either in their as a second piece.  12 controlled years of highly regarded prospects for two years of a 2B who turned 30 (at a very good price).  I don't think it matters what his WAR was this year so much. More to do with how he's expected to play in the future (and for only two more years). Friedman and Company understand that.

Alvarez I can agree with you, but Buehler is not in his tier at this point IMO. 

[jimmer]

 

Alvarez I can agree with you, but Buehler is not in his tier at this point IMO. 

Alvarez and Bellinger are their top prospects.  Buehler is a top 5 Dodgers prospect and it's a strong system. I prefer him to De Leon, but that doesn't mean I rank him even with Alvarez, just saying he is very good and closer to the majors than Alvarez.  

[doscinco]

As a rebuilding team, why would you trade a young player with years of control instead of a player in their 30's with only 2 years of control left?

You need pitching, badly, and you are trading from a position of strength. It's a challenge trade. Young player with promise for young player with promise.

[Cory Engelhardt]

 

You need pitching, badly, and you are trading from a position of strength. It's a challenge trade. Young player with promise for young player with promise.

 

But it isn't a position of strength if you are keeping the guy who won't be here in 2 years. It is a position of strength because you can trade Dozier and you have his replacement already in house.

[AZTwin]

I want no part of Stewart. If Stewart is the 2nd piece, then Lux better be the 3rd and Calhoun the 4th. I'd consider it then

[doscinco]

But it isn't a position of strength if you are keeping the guy who won't be here in 2 years. It is a position of strength because you can trade Dozier and you have his replacement already in house.

Dozier could be a late bloomer and this could be the start of his real prime, ala Jeff Kent/Daniel Murphy. He's not THAT old. And he seems to like Minnesota so he could be an extension candidate.

[Cory Engelhardt]

 

I want no part of Stewart. If Stewart is the 2nd piece, then Lux better be the 3rd and Calhoun the 4th. I'd consider it then

 

I don't agree. I think Stewart is a good get, and I also don't see a point in acquiring Calhoun. Lux would be good though.

[nicksaviking]

What could anyone possibly see in Walker Buehler's 5 innings of pro ball to put him ahead of De Leon in the rankings?

[AZTwin]

I don't agree. I think Stewart is a good get, and I also don't see a point in acquiring Calhoun. Lux would be good though.

I agree that Calhoun isn't good but as a 4th piece he adds some upside there and has a strong chance to be a utility player at the next level

[LenBarson]

Hi everyone, first time poster, long time lurker.

 

I don't understand the need for MLB ready pitching specifically. I like De Leon and I'd be happy with him as a trade centerpiece. However, I think the Twins should simply look to maximize value rather than target a lower quality player, simply because they're close to MLB.

 

I'd love to see a JDL + Alvarez package come to Minnesota. The Twins farm system is not depleted by any means, but with the graduation of several youngsters, I think the lower levels could stand to be replenished with a guy like Alvarez + #1 draft pick. I'd rather build a sustainable farm system with high upside prospects scattered across several levels.

 

If Dozier isn't traded this offseason, the speculation on the offers that may or may not have been received one way or the other, will be WILD.
 

[HawkeyeDodger]

 

The more I read about him, the more I like Stewart too. In some ways, almost more than De Leon, at least for being ready for a full season in 2017.

 

Outside of a few scouting reports that peg him as a 4/5, what else do people not like about him? He seems more than solid to me.

I think you're 100% right.  Stewart is getting labeled a #5 I think because he came out of nowhere.  He is far from a 2 pitch pitcher.  His change up is his best pitch.  I think this trade is tough partly because Deleon and Stewart are both big league ready compared to the other highly ranked pitchers in the system and whether or not $32 million is a sunk cost to some it is still a lot of money to invest in a kid only to ship him off so soon unless he has character issues.  Unfortunately the pitcher that I knew in the Dodgers system has now signed with the Mariners so I can't pick his brain for information.    I for one wouldn't have a problem including Lux in deal.  

[markos]

 

What could anyone possibly see in Walker Buehler's 5 innings of pro ball to put him ahead of De Leon in the rankings?

He was a potential top-10 pick before dealing with a elbow injury his junior year. He had TJ, and just came back late last year. Scouts from his outings have reported that his stuff is all the way back; in fact, he appears to be throwing harder than he did in college (working 95+, hitting 99). That is way better than De Leon's 91-93. Also, there is some concern that De Leon's change-up-centric approach won't miss bats in the big leagues, but Buehler has legitimate swing-and-miss pitches in both his slider/cutter and curve. 

 

Can't argue with De Leon's results so far, and I have him ahead of Buehler. But I can see the argument the other way.

[Lee-The-Twins-Fan]

 

Personally i think the Twins are pressing their luck doing this.  

 

An extended break over the holidays could change thoughts and attitudes and torpedo the deal.  The Dodgers I'm sure have limited patience and could throw up their hands and walk away while still being a good team next season.  The Twins don't have that luxury.  Its clear the advantage goes to LA on that one.  Now it's true the Twins don't "have to" deal Brian Dozier, but the truth is if they want to significantly improve the team he needs to be dealt at maximum value, which is now.    

 

You take De Leon and Alvarez and maybe a lesser prospect and thank your lucky stars and get ready for the season.  It would be fantastic if they got more to bolster the ranks, but sometimes a good deal is too good to turn down especially when your this bad.  

 

No, no, no, no, no. I disagree. You are settling. Alvarez is in rookie ball – he's at least two years away from reaching the major leagues. Do you know how many rookie league players – even really good prospects - never make it to the major leagues?

 

Dozier is a known commodity. He hit 42 home runs last year. He plays a very capable 2B, and hits with power, and has a club-friendly contract.

 

The Twins need a lot more than De Leon and Alvarez. At least one more MLB-ready pitcher.

 

Yes, the Twins need starting pitching. Yes, it would be good to trade Dozier for De Leon, another MLB-ready starter and prospects. But don't settle for less than the best.

 

Dozier is an integral part of the Twins offense – and an important asset. They should get considerable assets back for him.

[Otto von Ballpark]

Dozier could be a late bloomer and this could be the start of his real prime, ala Jeff Kent/Daniel Murphy. He's not THAT old. And he seems to like Minnesota so he could be an extension candidate.

Dozier and his agent were very publicly adament about not buying out any FA years in his current contract. I think it is pretty clear he wants to hit the open market in two years, or at least get a full market rate extension.

[DaveW]

Dozier and his agent were very publicly adament about not buying out any FA years in his current contract. I think it is pretty clear he wants to hit the open market in two years, or at least get a full market rate extension.

Yeah I don't see any sort of discount or any real reason for Dozier to agree to an extension.

 

Maybe if the Dodgers or someone offered him a 4 year 80 mil extension they would think about it? But I'm not sure I could see that happening.

[gunnarthor]

Is there any reason to think that Stewart isn't a slightly better Tyler Duffey?  Both were late round picks, fast to the majors, good success in their rookie seasons.  But the scouts said Duffey didn't have the stuff to stay in the rotation and those same scouts are saying Stewart's a back end guy.  He might be better but I don't want him as the second piece.  

 

According to mlbpipeline, the Dodgers have six top 100 prospects plus Buehler, Lux and Sheffield.  There should be a match in there somewhere.  

[Squirrel]

No no no. Haven't you heard? We should accept scraps for one of the best 2B in baseball

I don't think anyone has said this but I think there are some who think we should get the greatest package or not trade, and some who would be okay with a less than greatest package because now is the time