POTUS Donald Trump

[laloesch]

To turn this situation around Progressives need to speak up and get loud towards Republicans and Conservatives. Get in their faces, spit on their food, piss in their drinks, kick them out of your businesses and places you work at, refuse them service. Harass them on the street wherever and whenever possible if you see them. Shame them and bully them in public places whenever possible so that they scurry back into the dark holes from which they came. That is how we start pushing these people back. They are all cowards when confronted. The days of playing nice are over.

[PseudoSABR]

 

To turn this situation around Progressives need to speak up and get loud towards Republicans and Conservatives. Get in their faces, spit on their food, piss in their drinks, kick them out of your businesses and places you work at, refuse them service. Harass them on the street wherever and whenever possible if you see them. Shame them and bully them in public places whenever possible so that they scurry back into the dark holes from which they came. That is how we start pushing these people back. They are all cowards when confronted. The days of playing nice are over.

I'm with you about being passionate and standing up for what you believe and speaking truth to power, but harassment is just that harassment.  I certainly don't want any part in it; it further alienates people who might be persuadable but will react to how poorly we treat those whom we disagree with.  Many of Trump's supporters are simply ignorant, and not so willfully fascist (or whatever-ist); we should pity them, not shame/harass them. 

[Mike Sixel]

"Actually, I meant wouldn't'n't...."......not actually a quote....

[TheLeviathan]

 

I'm with you about being passionate and standing up for what you believe and speaking truth to power, but harassment is just that harassment.  I certainly don't want any part in it; it further alienates people who might be persuadable but will react to how poorly we treat those whom we disagree with.  Many of Trump's supporters are simply ignorant, and not so willfully fascist (or whatever-ist); we should pity them, not shame/harass them. 

 

This is really well said.

 

I'd add one thing.....shame and withdrawal do not seem to be feasible outcomes.  I highly doubt the right-wing would react in any other way but escalation.  They clearly have no shame anymore.

[PseudoSABR]

 

This is really well said.

 

I'd add one thing.....shame and withdrawal do not seem to be feasible outcomes.  I highly doubt the right-wing would react in any other way but escalation.  They clearly have no shame anymore.

Right.  It's not only a wrong tactic, it's probably ineffective.  Something, you keep saying over the years, and I see too, is that the left and center have to resist any notion of righteousness, or we self-fulfill the GOP prophecy about us.  

[D. Hocking]

Now is almost simply quoting Orwell:

 

"Just remember, what you’re seeing and what you’re reading is not what’s happening" -- Donald Trump, 7/24/18

 

 

He is also setting up the narrative that the 2018 elections were tampered with by Russia if the GOP has a bad showing.

 

I’m very concerned that Russia will be fighting very hard to have an impact on the upcoming Election. Based on the fact that no President has been tougher on Russia than me, they will be pushing very hard for the Democrats. They definitely don’t want Trump!

 

 

While the GOP occasionally has spoken out about regarding tariffs and Helsinki (although only verbally, when it comes to any substantive action they fall back in line), have they ever defended the press or called out any of his lies unless the absolutely had to?

[PseudoSABR]

 

While the GOP occasionally has spoken out about regarding tariffs and Helsinki (although only verbally, when it comes to any substantive action they fall back in line), have they ever defended the press or called out any of his lies unless the absolutely had to?

Flake did give a Senate floor speech defending the press.  Various others have tweeted about it.  But if your general point is that the GOP is complicit with Trump until its entirely void of political viability--that much is clearly true.

[TheLeviathan]

I appreciate Jeff Flake's moral stance and Bob Corker's willingness to fight back and resign over his frustrations, but at this point those kind of people are yelling into an abyss.

 

The right's disassociation with truth is really scary.

[Brock Beauchamp]

Dunno if I'm late to the party but CNN has the Cohen audio of Trump agreeing to pay off the National Enquirer to keep Karen MacDougal quiet.

 

https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2018/07/24/cohen-trump-audio-recording-cuomo-vpx.cnn

 

Will this move the needle significantly? No, probably not... but this is a man that didn't win the popular vote and isn't up for re-election. If Democrats have a brain amongst them, they will leverage the **** out of this non-stop flow of garbage to indict the entire GOP and their complicity this November.

 

They don't need to erode Trump's base, they need to kick independents in line and work their base into a lather.

[Brock Beauchamp]

 

No, that's Clinton's fault.  She had bad messaging and wasn't authentic.

 

What liberals have done in the aftermath is completely miss the lessons to be learned.  Now every lefty wants to pull the party to the left to solve her failure.  Here's a few examples (and you've heard versions of this in this thread.  Often attacking anyone who isn't as far left as they are):

 

"Clinton lost because Bernie supporters didn't vote for her!"  Um....no.  Even if tens of thousands of Bernie voters stayed home, they likely did that in Oregon, California, and New York and their votes are meaningless anyway.  Look at the data in the relevant states.  This was not one of the factors that caused the loss.  

 

"Clinton's policies weren't boldly left enough!"  Policies are irrelevant.  They shouldn't be, but they are.  The goblin in office didnt' have a single coherent policy.  Neither did Obama either, for that matter.

 

"I'll be damned if we capitulate to white hicks!"  Well, ok, but that's largely why you lost.  She lost three key midwestern states and got her ass handed to her by the rural and black vote.  Not leftists sitting out.  That's just a fact, sorry it's inconvenient for anyone's personal politics...but do you want to win or do you want people to agree with you?

 

If you're a doctor treating this problem, you look at the actual facts.  Not what you want them to be.  You don't take the medicine you want, you take the one you need.  Hillary lost because of arrogance and indifference to poor and rural whites and less appeal to black voters.  She lost  because she was inauthentic and couldn't message to people outside the 40% of people who vote Democrat.  Not because socialists weren't appeased.

I agree except with the part where the Democratic party is wrong for moving left. The party needs to move left because collectively, they're the protectors of the status quo in a nation that absolutely despises the status quo. The party needs to shed that notion with ideas about how to make things better for everyone. That means moving left on a lot of really crappy, "please everyone and no one" ideas like the ACA.

[TheLeviathan]

I agree about embracing policy that is further left....just wrap it in centric messaging.

[gunnarthor]

 

I agree about embracing policy that is further left....just wrap it in centric messaging.

Yep. Every republican is getting tied to Trump, the most unpopular President ever. Dems should be pushing economic messaging that targets the harm created by the GOP tax bill and cuts to health care. The fact that the GOP has to create an emergency farm aid bill should be pushed hard about how ineffective they've been in strengthening our economy.

[Badsmerf]

That audio isn't as damming as it could be. It doesn't directly say Karen McDougal, so it takes logic and reasoning to figure out what the meaning is. That type of corruption is beyond the effort Trump base is willing to put in. My wife listened to it with me, and she said "so this is all a big conspiracy theory then? Doesn't sound like he's talking about anything incriminating." I expect that reaction from many people, and conservative media to twist it into a pretzel.

 

The last bit is irritating. There isn't a single liberal outlet (my opinion) that would try to cover up this type of behavior. Had Clinton been wrapped in this type of controversy, her approval rating would be below 25%, and possibly already impeached.

[Brock Beauchamp]

 

That audio isn't as damming as it could be. It doesn't directly say Karen McDougal, so it takes logic and reasoning to figure out what the meaning is.

It doesn't take much effort, as the entire "conspiracy" is that Trump paid for a "buy and kill" story through the National Enquirer, run by David Pecker. MacDougal didn't try to extort Trump for money, she sold it to the NE, expecting it to be published.

 

And it appears Cohen is flipping on Trump, so we don't need to think too hard about the meaning, we'll likely see testimony/depositions explaining its exact meaning.

[jimmer]

For the avid Trumpites, there is nothing he could do or has done that would stop them from loving him.

[TheLeviathan]

Yep. Every republican is getting tied to Trump, the most unpopular President ever. Dems should be pushing economic messaging that targets the harm created by the GOP tax bill and cuts to health care. The fact that the GOP has to create an emergency farm aid bill should be pushed hard about how ineffective they've been in strengthening our economy.

The win is being gift wrapped in November. People don't vote on policy, they vote on emotions and pocketbooks and the left has plenty on both issues to win with.

 

Now how will they screw it up asks the cynic in me....

[PseudoSABR]

 

For the avid Trumpites, there is nothing he could do or has done that would stop them from loving him.

I think this is true but it begs the question as to why Trump is so servile to Putin, if Putin doesn't have information that Trump is afraid will come out.  Whatever Putin has on him is some how worse than shooting some one on 5th Ave.  (For instance I wonder if Trump (or his modelling company) got involved in sex trafficking of minors or some such.)

[gunnarthor]

So, Trump just tweeted that Sessions (who has recused himself) should fire Mueller. 

[Badsmerf]

Faux News is going hard after the Mueller investigation right now. My right wing Facebook friends are posting all kinds of garbage about conspiracies with the Clinton Foundation, the dossier, uranium, etc.

 

There is no way they have any self respect anymore. I never thought a major news outlet would push this hard to help muddy waters of a legitimate inquiry into a foreign country ****ing with our election. It's now being stopped up to a whole new level.

[D. Hocking]

about conspiracies with the Clinton Foundation, the dossier, uranium, etc.

 

including weaponizing clothing that was popular in the 70's

 

“We already have a smocking gun about a campaign getting dirt on their opponent, it was Hillary Clinton. How is it OK for Hillary Clinton to proactively seek dirt from the Russians but the Trump campaign met at the Russians request and that is bad?” Marc Thiessen, Washington Post

 

 

Last night he retweeted his son's tweet showing Jim Acosta being screamed at during his rally.  Weren't they all upset about the Democrats not being civil a few weeks ago?  At some point he is going to whip them into an anti-media frenzy that one of these reporters is going to be physically attacked.

 

His twitter meltdown makes me wonder if there are more indictments coming in the semi-near future.

[gunnarthor]

 

 

 

His twitter meltdown makes me wonder if there are more indictments coming in the semi-near future.

Well, if Cohen is telling the truth about Trump prepping for that meeting, it's likely that several people could be indicted for lying about it, maybe including Don Jr.

[Squirrel]

That hammer needs to fall soon before Trump makes it impossible to get to the end. He’s working very hard to undo the judicial system, to invalidate the media, to whip people into an attack frenzy ... this is not going to end well one way or another, imo

[Badsmerf]

They are worried about losing control of the House in November, which is why I'm guessing they are pushing for an end so hard. Also, Kavanaugh's confirmation just got tougher south his stance on this investigation and indicting a sitting president. Once republicans lose control of the House... I expect **** to really hit the fan. No longer will they be able to hide behind majority control. Then, after all the facts are on the table in 2020, I genuinely expect the Republicans standing up for Trump and against the Mueller probe to be out of Congress. At least some...

[jimmer]

Speaking of ways the Trump is literally trying to buy votes, the Azzhat-in-Chief decides to mess up trade and it hits farmers hard.  Trump is like, 'Oh man, GOP is going to be in sooooo much trouble with farmers getting bent over by my trade policies so I'll bail them out (at least until midterms are over).'

[D. Hocking]

Um - he also made them a green farmer version of his MAGA hat (or China possibly made the hat), so you cannot say he is not a thoughtful leader.   

 

For some reason I decided to actually check out his page and those hats.  Sadly the farmer hats are sold out (they are $45!). Has any other president had merchandise sales be a key part of his webpage?   I will give him this, it is not like he is hiding his grifter and mercenary side. 

 

Russian investigation aside, if a Democratic president tried to monetize off of the presidency like he has - staying at the resorts, selling items with the presidential seal at the resorts, kids still running the business and still being in political situations, Jared and Ivanka in charge of things which they are no where near qualified etc. how many congressional committee would be set up to investigate the president?

[jimmer]

https://www.cnn.com/2018/07/23/opinions/trump-is-taking-us-down-the-path-to-tyranny-sachs/index.html

 

[Badsmerf]

https://www.cnn.com/2018/07/23/opinions/trump-is-taking-us-down-the-path-to-tyranny-sachs/index.html

Missed that, thanks for sharing. The parallels to Nazi Germany are uncomfortable. I suggest to anyone that hasn't, to go to Germany and a concentration camp in particular. My faith in our democracy had severely deteriorated over the least 2 years, and I can't imagine it getting better the next 2. I just hope we can survive without starting a war, or plunging into another great recession or worse. The next problem we'll have, is coming to terms with the millions of people that still support this type of anti American values dressed up in sheep's clothing. I don't think this is going to end well in my lifetime.

[jimmer]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/giuliani-comment-focuses-attention-on-campaign-huddle-2-days-before-trump-tower-meeting/ar-BBLnqVo

 

In a television interview Monday, Giuliani disclosed a meeting that took place June 7, 2016, involving seven senior Trump campaign officials - which he said included Donald Trump Jr., Jared Kushner, Paul Manafort and Richard Gates, Manafort's top deputy.

The timing is significant because it came as Trump Jr., Kushner and Manafort prepared to meet with a Russian lawyer who, they had been told, had "information that would incriminate" Hillary Clinton. On the evening of June 7, Donald Trump told a crowd of campaign supporters that he would soon "give a major speech," which he suggested would unveil Russia-related improprieties committed by both Hillary and Bill Clinton, the former president.

 

Two days later, however, when the meeting with the Russian lawyer, Natalia Veselnitskaya, took place at Trump Tower, she provided no incriminating information about the Clintons, according to subsequent statements by both Trump Jr. and Kushner. Donald Trump never gave the promised speech.

To hear President Trump and his defenders tell it, he knew nothing during the 2016 campaign about the offer of Russian-provided dirt on Clinton. Trump insists he did not know about the Trump Tower meeting until it became public last year.

[jimmer]

 

Missed that, thanks for sharing. The parallels to Nazi Germany are uncomfortable. I suggest to anyone that hasn't, to go to Germany and a concentration camp in particular. My faith in our democracy had severely deteriorated over the least 2 years, and I can't imagine it getting better the next 2. I just hope we can survive without starting a war, or plunging into another great recession or worse. The next problem we'll have, is coming to terms with the millions of people that still support this type of anti American values dressed up in sheep's clothing. I don't think this is going to end well in my lifetime.

We are no longer a Republic.  Trump has secured his power.  The GOP in Congress won't check him, he's ruining the court system, and he can say and do whatever he wants while his followers and minions do nothing.  He can even tell his AG to have an investigation against him stopped and people say he's not trying to obstruct justice.

[adorduan]

I don't know about you guys, but I don't need a friggin picture ID to buy groceries....