POTUS Donald Trump

[ashbury]

As far as actual brainwashing--which are hegemonic in nature; both tacit and hidden in plain sight. Take the pledge of allegiance, national anthems at sporting events,

I was away from teh intarwebs for several days, and catching up on this thread was daunting. I was considering whether to bother trying to reply at this late date about the conservative slant to elementary school, or kids' lives in general at that age, but your post popped up and covered a lot of what I was going to say. The daily Pledge and the Star Spangled Banner are great examples.

 

Kids doing fund-raising for their schools, and likewise groups such as Boy Scouts and Girl Scouts fund-raising, always are carefully positioned to convey a market-based "message" to the kids - you daren't simply ask for a handout to help fund the cause, you have to offer something in return, like home-baked chocolate chip cookies.

 

History and geography are taught from a very US-centric point of view.

 

There is very little alternative point of view to the standard "mainstream conservative" bent, where youngsters are concerned.

 

What best made me recognize this was having colleagues who grew up in countries outside the US. Almost invariably they are shocked to learn that a Pledge of Allegiance is demanded of six year olds in a school. Post-WWII Germany flushed that kind of thing out - though it's creeping back in.

 

Americans are pretty insular. Getting those truly different points of view from outside our borders is curative, but the inward-turning conservative mainstream is adamantly opposed to permitting that. When even a little of it occurs, the right-wing outrage is instantaneous and loud. Their main aim is to shush things up.

[TheLeviathan]

I guess I've always been resistant to the idea that "God" on our money or putting my hand on my chest on the pledge was having any kind of significant impact on me.  As a generally non-religious (but not anti-religious) person, the inundation with Christianity throughout my life did nothing to keep me there.  Now maybe it does for some, but I've always been dubious of that claim.  I've tended to believe that things need to be more willfully done for them to stick.

 

It's part of why I'm dubious of the claim that merely having left-leaning people in your life, be it as teachers or reporters or clergy or doctor, is somehow brainwashing you either.  

 

And even if both of those are true and my opinion about their impact is wrong, I'm still not sure it's important. I believe those kinds of bias/suggestion are of a completely different magnitude than the problem of what Jones, Levin, Hannity, and Limbaugh have done to Republicanism.  And that's the kind of vile brainwashing I see happening on the right.

[PseudoSABR]

 

I guess I've always been resistant to the idea that "God" on our money or putting my hand on my chest on the pledge was having any kind of significant impact on me.  As a generally non-religious (but not anti-religious) person, the inundation with Christianity throughout my life did nothing to keep me there.  Now maybe it does for some, but I've always been dubious of that claim.  I've tended to believe that things need to be more willfully done for them to stick.

 

It's part of why I'm dubious of the claim that merely having left-leaning people in your life, be it as teachers or reporters or clergy or doctor, is somehow brainwashing you either.  

 

And even if both of those are true and my opinion about their impact is wrong, I'm still not sure it's important. I believe those kinds of bias/suggestion are of a completely different magnitude than the problem of what Jones, Levin, Hannity, and Limbaugh have done to Republicanism.  And that's the kind of vile brainwashing I see happening on the right.

I think brainwashing is too heavy of a term; rather these little rituals set the baseline for what is normal, and what is acceptable or even encouraged to believe.   Those whose parents encourage critical thinking probably aren't at all influenced, but the rest of the kids, it does provide that baseline normality, against which they may measure themselves.  

 

And I think that's part of the problem with having this discussion is that many conservatives may equate their own beliefs with normality, and so any deviation away from their own beliefs is necessarily ideological to them.   Conservatives may not like it, but secularism is not some left-ist idea--secularism, at its best, provides viewpoint neutral education (which leaves things like fact and science). There may not be a workable middle ground, unfortunately.  

[TheLeviathan]

 

I think brainwashing is too heavy of a term; rather these little rituals set the baseline for what is normal, and what is acceptable or even encouraged to believe.   Those whose parents encourage critical thinking probably aren't at all influenced, but the rest of the kids, it does provide that baseline normality, against which they may measure themselves.  

 

And I think that's part of the problem with having this discussion is that many conservatives may equate their own beliefs with normality, and so any deviation away from their own beliefs is necessarily ideological to them.   Conservatives may not like it, but secularism is not some left-ist idea--secularism, at its best, provides viewpoint neutral education (which leaves things like fact and science). There may not be a workable middle ground, unfortunately.  

 

That's fair, I've just never put much stock into the argument that ubiquitous references to deities were likely to impact anyone very much.  Or that they are a small drop in the bucket compared to much more overt attempts to influence.

 

Similarly, I don't think being in the same room with a liberal is somehow going to make you one by osmosis.  Nor will watching 10 minutes of ABC News a night.  That complaint of the right, IMO, is a trumped up boogeyman that is part of the very brainwashing I'm concerned with.  It preys on a long-standing human response you outline in that last paragraph.  There are times that response has validity, but in Republican circles that response is largely hysteria.  And it's feeding a dangerously insulated mentality.

 

 

[Mike Sixel]

How many Democrats are going to vote for this CIA director? What does this "party" even stand for?

[stringer bell]

At least two Mike. Paul and McCain are Republican noes. That will give her enough votes to be confirmed.

[Champuckett]

 

How many Democrats are going to vote for this CIA director? What does this "party" even stand for?

 

Just enough of the blackmailed senators (from both sides) to get her through.  Only a few Republicans are voting no, so they only need a few of these Democrats to confirm.

 

These political parties have not stood for much of anything in quite some time and voting in the person that was instrumental in developing torture programs reaffirms this.

[D. Hocking]

When asked what she would do if Trump asked her to use torture, didn't she reply he would never do that?  This from a man who already had said he believes torture works.  I am sure the Senate followed up on that.  Really the majority of the people who have been nominated and confirmed have been either unqualified for their job or chosen specifically because they will dismantle the agency they are going to be heading.  We are going to be paying for the lack of any true conviction on the Hill for a long, long time just for some of the judicial appointments alone.

 

Sounds like there is a chance Trump might not be getting his Noble Peace Prize for solving the Korean problem.  I still don't think there is an ambassador to South Korea, which I think could be problematic.

[gunnarthor]

 

How many Democrats are going to vote for this CIA director? What does this "party" even stand for?

They stand for winning elections which means they'll bend over backwards to not look bad to rust belt voters before the midterms. I guess being seen as the party against torture is too controversial.  

 

It does seem like the Dems might be working on a strategy to pull defeat out of the jaws of victory here. 

[Mike Sixel]

They stand for winning elections which means they'll bend over backwards to not look bad to rust belt voters before the midterms. I guess being seen as the party against torture is too controversial.

 

It does seem like the Dems might be working on a strategy to pull defeat out of the jaws of victory here.

Indeed. The next time they have a strategy will be the first time. Seeing this ineptitude,I just want to ask how anyone thinks the left has some group pulling the strings on this country!

[TheLeviathan]

And yet if you listen to right-wing radio all they talk about is how organized, coordinated, and efficient the left is and all their swampy right wingers should take notes from them.

 

You can almost laugh at the absurdity if it wasn't painful for all of us.

[jimmer]

'Trump admitted he attacks press to shield himself from negative coverage, 60 Minutes reporter says'

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/trump-admitted-he-attacks-press-to-shield-himself-from-negative-coverage-60-minutes-reporter-says/ar-AAxF1YA

 

'At the Deadline Club Awards presentation, Woodruff asked Stahl about her November 2016 interview with Trump — his first after the election victory. Stahl described going to meet with him at Trump Tower before the interview, along with one of her bosses, whom she did not name. After Trump began to unload on the news media, she said, she asked him whether he planned to stop attacking the press  — a hallmark of his campaign — now that he had been elected.

“I said, you know that is getting tired, why are you doing this — you’re doing it over and over and it’s boring,” Stahl said. “He said you know why I do it? I do it to discredit you all and demean you all, so when you write negative stories about me no one will believe you.”

[gunnarthor]

Trump with a little more dog whistling as he uninvites the Eagles to the White House

 

https://www.cnn.com/2018/06/04/politics/trump-eagles-nfl/index.html

[PseudoSABR]

 

Trump with a little more dog whistling as he uninvites the Eagles to the White House

 

https://www.cnn.com/2018/06/04/politics/trump-eagles-nfl/index.html

It sounds like a good time any way; I imagine he'll get a nice crowd.

[D. Hocking]

I am guessing he did not want to show off which is why he quit singing, not that he did not know the words to God Bless America.  You think he maybe would have learned the words for this, although I ready he has spent a total 8 to 10 hours prepping for the NK summit, so that would be a lot to expect.  Plus that would cut into his time live-tweeting Fox News.  He has two large international summits coming up and he is spending much of his day watching the State TV soothe his ego.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YDbmGNuZQPE

[Badsmerf]

I'm really applauding the tariff responses from Mexico and others. Targeting Trump states to hopefully send a message. There is no question this will hurt the economies. They should also have put it in corn... That would have been a big wake up to the Midwest.

[TheLeviathan]

A trade war up to November is going to be a big boost for Dems and a wedge issue to the GOP.

 

And it'llhurt a lot of people.

[Brock Beauchamp]

 

I am guessing he did not want to show off which is why he quit singing, not that he did not know the words to God Bless America.  You think he maybe would have learned the words for this, although I ready he has spent a total 8 to 10 hours prepping for the NK summit, so that would be a lot to expect.  Plus that would cut into his time live-tweeting Fox News.  He has two large international summits coming up and he is spending much of his day watching the State TV soothe his ego.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YDbmGNuZQPE

To be fair to the man who deserves no fairness, singing in a group with speakers echoing can throw off anyone who isn't trained to sing.

[Brock Beauchamp]

 

I'm really applauding the tariff responses from Mexico and others. Targeting Trump states to hopefully send a message. There is no question this will hurt the economies. They should also have put it in corn... That would have been a big wake up to the Midwest.

They don't need to enact more tariffs, really. The thing about tariffs is that they won't have a real impact for quite awhile, certainly not seven months.

 

So maybe Trump gets elected from the clownshoe demographic again... unlikely, but possible. He didn't even win the popular vote last time and his popularity numbers are still bad. Thankfully, he has two more years to drive this lawn dart into the ground before election season (thankfully?).

 

But Congress will swing Democrat. Maybe they won't win outright majority but it'll equalize a lot.

 

And that means when the census comes around in 2020, liberals will be in the driver's seat. They'll have a president everyone hates with bad economic principles with a Congress primed to sweep over the nation.

 

Not that I really like the Democrats, but they're far less idiotic than the current GOP.

[twinsnorth49]

So apparently we burned down the White House once upon a time? Which explains why we're a threat to national security.

 

Makes sense. 

http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/no-answer.gif

[Badsmerf]

I'm interested to see how this g6 I mean g7 summit goes. Trump feuding with Macron is a joke. He is destroying all our global relationships. I'm floored 40% of the public approves of the job he's doing.

 

Side note for November. It is going to be tough for the democrats to win the Senate. There is a good chance they take the house, but the Senate map will be difficult. I actually think it will benefit them in 2020 to only have the house. Trump is very good at lying, and will have more ammo if the democrats have all of Congress.

[USAFChief]

 

So apparently we burned down the White House once upon a time? Which explains why we're a threat to national security.

 

Makes sense. 

http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/no-answer.gif

We should immediately put a tariff on hockey players. Keep those jobs home. Maybe maple as well. Bats should be made from ash.

[jimmer]

Now Trump is pushing to have Russia in G7 summit.  And the rest of the countries seem to be thinking maybe not having the US in the agreement at all.

 

'French President Emmanuel Macron also suggested that the six other countries of the G7 would be happy to exclude the US from the final statement. “The American President may not mind being isolated, but neither do we mind signing a 6 country agreement if need be,” Macron tweeted on Thursday.'

[ashbury]

Bats should be made from ash.

Sounds painful. Pass.

[Badsmerf]

Is anyone really surprised the rest of the world is sick of Trump's shtick? I work for a German company, and it's embarrassing to discuss politics. I do have a good amount of colleagues in the US that are big trump supporters... The Germans probably roll their eyes at them like I do.

[PseudoSABR]

 

Now Trump is pushing to have Russia in G7 summit.  And the rest of the countries seem to be thinking maybe not having the US in the agreement at all.

I mean how do conservatives justify Trump's push to have Russia in the G7?  What's in it for the U.S.?  I mean if Russia and Trump had colluded to get him elected what else could Trump being doing to honor  that deal?   

[Badsmerf]

I mean how do conservatives justify Trump's push to have Russia in the G7? What's in it for the U.S.? I mean if Russia and Trump had colluded to get him elected what else could Trump being doing to honor that deal?

Party over politics (country). Putin loves Trump. Not only is Trump ripping apart our democracy in the US, he is creating divisions across the world in the G7.

 

Has anyone seen any polls about Russia? Has Trump's love for them influenced the American public? This foreign policy is a huge vulnerability.

[TheLeviathan]

 

I mean how do conservatives justify Trump's push to have Russia in the G7?  What's in it for the U.S.?  I mean if Russia and Trump had colluded to get him elected what else could Trump being doing to honor  that deal?   

 

They focus on him thumbing his nose at the rest of the G7 for unbalanced trade deals.  I'm 100% against trade wars, but Trump isn't entirely wrong that the rest of the G7 is taking advantage of those deals.  

 

If we're going to hand out charitable trade deals I guess I'd rather it go to nations that need more help than the other juggernauts.

[gunnarthor]

The trade agreements the US is part of treat the US far better than others, despite some loopholes for other countries. To suggest that Canada is screwing Americas farmers without discussing how the trade agreements benefits Americas economy is dishonest. Surprisingly, Trump does it anyway.

 

https://www.politico.com/story/2018/06/09/trump-g7-allies-clashes-trade-tariffs-russia-635006

 

Great diplomacy. The other G7 countries pretty much know that Trump's word is worthless. Gad, what a giant piece of ****.

[D. Hocking]

He is in Singapore, theoretically prepping for a meeting that is probably being done more for a photo-op rather than the time is right for this summit, and he cannot stop tweeting about the G7 summit, trade, and how he is treated unfairly by the rest of the world.  Although Trump will know in a minute if the NK summit will work, so perhaps prepping a lot is not necessary.

 

Peter Navarro said there should be a special place in hell for Trudeau, because he basically did not just accept Trump's rantings and contradicted him.  Kudlow said Trudeau stabbed Trump in the back. Meanwhile, Putin should not be excluded for "something" he did a few years ago (annexing Crimea).   Trudeau is now being demonized far worse than Putin ever has.

 

You can tell he is really beloved and respected by them, especially Merkle.  He is looking very dignified and Presidential here