Article: Report: Twins Place Trevor Plouffe On Outright Waivers

[jimmer]

It's a BS move.  The guy has been in the organization for 13 years and they drop him by voicemail. There really is no rationalizing that kind of move to make it look like it's an okay way to do it.  It's like asking for a divorce by text message.

[Mr. Brooks]

well, Ryan said he didn't try to trade Plouffe. The guy averaged 3 WAR in the previous two seasons. A guy like that SHOULD have value if you try and move him.

 

Some have gotten what they want. Enjoy. Should be funny to watch.

Sano wouldn't be the first young player to improve his defense from bad to acceptable or better.

I really don't understand why you are so sure that Sano can't improve. Especially considering between injury and DH/RF its been almost 4 years since he's had a chance to get any regular reps there.

[Mr. Brooks]

It's a BS move. The guy has been in the organization for 13 years and they drop him by voicemail. There really is no rationalizing that kind of move to make it look like it's an okay way to do it. It's like asking for a divorce by text message.

Well if you consider a business relationship to be the same as a marriage then yeah, there is really no point in further discussion.

[Mr. Brooks]

Just out of curiosity jimmer, do your standards work both ways?

If a player had an opt out and exercised it through their agent instead of calling the team directly would you be as bothered by that?

[HitInAPinch]

 

Well I'm guessing they didn't necessarily want to do it via voice mail, but I guess I don't understand what you expected them to do if Trevor didn't answer his phone.
I would imagine they figured he'd rather hear it from a voice mail rather than find out from social media.

Leave voice mail asking him to call back as soon as he can.  That's the way professionals do it.

[Mr. Brooks]

So now Levine is not a professional?

I figured these guys would have a short leash with some fans, but I didn't think it would be this short.

[Mr. Brooks]

I just find it amazing that people can make judgements on a person's character, when they've never met the person, and only have heard one side of the story, without even being willing to consider that there might be extenuating circumstances or missing information.

[Otto von Ballpark]

The arbitration system is broken. It's stupid that every team but the Twins can pay Plouffe less money*. The forced pay increases within the system far too often force teams to non-tender their home-grown talent when they have an off-year (or injury) in the final years of arbitration. The previous salary should have no bearing on an arbitration number--perhaps time-served should or previous production (but not salary itself); if a player has a career year in his year of arbitration, but gets hurt or regresses back to the mean, non-tendering is far too often the outcome. The system deemphasizes teams retaining their own talent in such situations, when it should do the opposite.

 

This is the right move. But Plouffe probably would have had a place on this team (or have been a tradeable asset) at a (much) lower cost.

 

*I suppose Plouffe could have accepted a pay cut, but I doubt that outcome happens very rarely if at all.

After a non-tender, the Twins could re-sign Plouffe the same as any other club.

 

If it seems rare, it is probably because nontenders are relatively rare themselves. But it does happen -- just eyeballing last year's nontender tracker at MLBTR, I see 3 guys who re-signed with their previous club. (Marginal players, admittedly, but virtually all nontenders are.) Jack Cust was a notable nontender and re-sign back in the day.

 

I just don't think there is any evidence that teams are losing an exorbitant number of talents like Plouffe thanks to the arbitration system. (Heck, Plouffe himself is 30 years old and has been Twins property for 12.5 seasons, it does not appear the Twins are even losing him egregiously early.)

[jimmer]

 

Just out of curiosity jimmer, do your standards work both ways?
If a player had an opt out and exercised it through their agent instead of calling the team directly would you be as bothered by that?

yes

[jimmer]

 

I just find it amazing that people can make judgements on a person's character, when they've never met the person, and only have heard one side of the story, without even being willing to consider that there might be extenuating circumstances or missing information.

I find it amazing you assume anyone is making an assumption about someone's character based on one move.

 

Someone can say it's a BS move without assuming the people making the move are always jerks. I don't remember saying these guys are total jerks because of one thing. People can have jerk moments without actually being a jerk.

 

I find the way they told Plouffe to be a horrible way to do it.  It was a borderline unprofessional way to do it.  I don't assume these people are horrible or are unprofessional based on this one thing.

Edited November 19, 2016 by jimmer

[Mr. Brooks]

I find it amazing you assume anyone is making an assumption about someone's character based on one move.

 

Someone can say it's a BS move without assuming the people making the move are always jerks. I don't remember saying these guys are total jerks because of one thing. People can have jerk moments without actually being a jerk.

 

I find the way they told Plouffe to be a horrible way to do it. It was a borderline unprofessional way to do it. I don't assume these people are horrible or are unprofessional based on this one thing.

Someone said he wasn't a professional because of this. That is absolutely a judgement of his character.

 

If the article had said he found out via social media, would you call that a BS move?

Because it's possible that is exactly what would have happened had Levine left a message saying "Trevor call me back", and then was too busy making other transactions to answer Plouffe's return call right away.

 

I just think you are ignoring that there might have been other circumstances that could make this not a BS move.

[Otto von Ballpark]

The new front office guys did talk to Plouffe's agent very recently. So the call about his release wasn't at all unexpected.

 

Also, would it really be better to leave a voicemail saying "call me back" only to have Plouffe hear the news by some other means first? (Note by that point, the info was out of the Twins control, as it had been filed with league)

[Mr. Brooks]

The new front office guys did talk to Plouffe's agent very recently. So the call about his release wasn't at all unexpected.

 

Also, would it really be better to leave a voicemail saying "call me back" only to have Plouffe hear the news by some other means first? (Note by that point, the info was out of the Twins control, as it had been filed with league)

Yeah that is my line of thinking.

I'm giving Levine the benefit of the doubt, because of what we've heard from ownership and at the introductory presser regarding his and Falvey's strong character.

I'm thinking that once Plouffe didn't answer his phone, he was either going to find out via voicemail or social media. And that Levine figured it would be better he hear it from him personally, even if by voicemail, than from fans on Twitter.

[Richie the Rally Goat]

Just read about Plouffe's release in the St. Paul paper. Get this:

 

"New Twins general manager Thad Levine left a detailed voice message on Friday “explaining the situation,” said Plouffe, who was working out at the time."

 

Released via Voice Message ?? Not cool......

 

http://www.twincities.com/2016/11/18/minnesota-twins-place-trevor-plouffe-on-outright-waivers/

i would imagine a call like that might/would/should be scheduled a day or two in advance with his agent. It might be somewhat common for players to not want to take that call directly.

[HitInAPinch]

 

i would imagine a call like that might/would/should be scheduled a day or two in advance with his agent. It might be somewhat common for players to not want to take that call directly.

 

Yeah, maybe Levine did talk to Plouffe's agent.  Actually, I'd say that's a good possibility, considering new management, more emphasis on advanced metrics, etc.  I just quoted directly from an article.

 

Plouffe is handling it very well.  Once the high $$$ deals are done, I bet he gets a job pretty quickly.

[Halsey Hall]

Thank the Lord!

[Halsey Hall]

 

Culling the herd is necessary sometimes. Plouffe was probably a bit under appreciated around here but he certainly needed to go in order to get this crate moving forward.

Where's Halsey? Too drunk from the celebration I imagine.

I was at the duck shack with 10" of snow and 45 mph winds.  Ma Nature was so happy she let it all go!  I don't drink, but when I saw it on the news I did have a cold one from my buddy.  So happy!!!!!  Now this team can improve and move forward.

Edited November 21, 2016 by Halsey Hall

[diehardtwinsfan]

Mod note, let's drop the voicemail tangent.  Goodness.