Article: Twins Fire General Manager Terry Ryan

[nicksaviking]

Interesting that an assistant GM in another organization is assigned to have experience and worthy of hiring, but an assistant GM from this organization has no experience. Hey, I sure hope that Rob Antony is truly an interim GM only, but he certainly has similar experience as other assistant GM's.

If the current Twins assistant GM was the combined spirit of Branch Rickey and Ed Barrow and said spirit had a double major in Statistical Analysis and Quntitative ESP, I still wouldn't want him.

 

This team needs gutting and the smell of failure and stubbornness needs to be throughly exercised from the whole organization.

[Rosterman]

 

Sure, it's a worst case scenario, but it would never happen. Even if Antony knows the odds are against him sticking around, there's got to be some integrity to do what's best for the organization you're working with until the day you're no longer working there. 

The reality

 of baseball is that there is changeover. Yes, there are only so many jobs, but if you are a solid baseball person, you will find another job. To work your entire career in one organization is a blessing (and a curse). The Twins have long kept guys around a lot longer than the new world of baseball. Partly because they have really only had two owners in their half-century. And they also thought they were developing front office talent. Yet MacPhail came from outside. And they did allow a couple of guys to walk away from heir own system: Krvinsky and Gebhard are two.

[HitInAPinch]

 

Carl did not like baseball, Eloise did. Carl did like the assest that appreciated

and it did appreciate,  by a lot!

[PseudoSABR]

I wonder if the Twins HOF induction had more to do with the timing than the trade deadline.   If Pohlad had made the decision to fire TR sometime prior to yesterday, he may have been advised to wait until after the Twins HOF induction ceremony, as to avoid the inevitable distraction, gloomy cloud it would have cast over the ceremony had TR been fired not long beforehand. 

[Mike Sixel]

 

Prepare for a fire sale and the total salary dump thing is real, why else would TR choose to step away now whe................

........................

enough to bring another World Championship to this organization. The owners are just not bold enough to bring themselves to the brink of spending just enough to win. 

 

Would a salary dump be bad?

 

Mauer, Plouffe, Santana, Nolasco, Perkins, Dozier, Hughes....which of those do you want to keep around?

Edited July 18, 2016 by Mike Sixel

[Tuba]

I think its rather simple. 4/5 seasons have been 90 losses. That's too many. 

[mlhouse]

The problem with Terry Ryan is that the type of team he was pretty succesful being the GM of is different than this team.  

 

Ryan GMed a marginal playoff team on a limited budget.  That meant you built around the young talent that the Twins had with "money-ball" type of role players on cheap contracts.  You were patient with the young prospects and moved them up slowly.  That is why the rebuilding Twins, a team that has lost or is going to lose 90 or more games 5 out of the last six seasons does not solve its pitching problems by signing marginal starters like Phil Hughes, Ricky Nolansco, and Ervin Santana to mid-level, multi-year free agent contracts.  Maybe that would have improved the 2001-2010 Minnesota Twins substantially, but not this group.  It was wasted money.

We need a front office and on the field management team that can work with and develop young talent.  That talent is going to make mistakes.  They are going to perform poorly in many cases.  We are going to recognize that we will lose ball games.  But those are the steps we need to take to get back to competitive baseball.  This has been obvious for 5 years now.

[Mike Sixel]

Some day I'd really like to know just how much was in TR's control, and how much was the owners or DSP.......or what. 

[Vanimal46]

 

Some day I'd really like to know just how much was in TR's control, and how much was the owners or DSP.......or what. 

Maybe we'll find out 15 years down the road in TR's tell-all book, "The Bullpen is our #1 priority (winky face)"

[Jerr]

 

Shine is overstating it, I agree.  My point is that this is his audition for either this club or others.  If he can show that he can make good baseball decisions and not get eaten alive by more seasoned GM's that will go a long ways to getting another job.

 

Doing nothing seems foolhardy.  Expecting him to do nothing makes the timing of the removal of Ryan even more questionable.  

The bolded!

[Kobs]

Terry Ryan has been a poor general manager since the early 2000s. He knew how to operate in the old baseball world, but once people started putting in effort to gain a better understanding of the game, he's been awful. 

 

When Ryan came back, I basically gave up having any interest in the team. It was like a floundering company banning email and installing a bunch of fax machines. I couldn't put effort into supporting an organization so divergent from what I saw as the forward thinking path. Hopefully those days are over, and I can slowly come back to following the team.

[Jerr]

And this firing sure woke up Twins Daily  

[Old Twins Cap]

Twins brand of accountability: 

 

"You're fired!   When would you like to leave?"

 

For F*xx's sake, what about the team?

[tobi0040]

The statement by Pohlad that the new GM can't fire Molitor is really disturbing.

 

Isn't that kind of like saying he knows better? Also that off the bat isn't a good recruiting statement by the owner. Sends up a red flag that he will meddle

[lukeduke1980]

 

Maybe we'll find out 15 years down the road in TR's tell-all book, "The Bullpen is our #1 priority (winky face)"

I'm excited to read the Robbie Grossman chapter

[Vanimal46]

I'm not quite sure what to think about TR's legacy, given what we know now. He left the first time during an offseason where very crucial decisions needed to be made (trading Johan, negotiating contracts for Cuddyer, Hunter, etc.) Of course the cancer diagnosis played into that decision to leave the first time...

 

Now this time, it's been reported that he orchestrated his exit, and he decides now is the time to do so 2 weeks before a critical trade deadline.

 

He's done good for the organization, but man, he's now left twice before having to make franchise altering decisions.

[SwainZag]

 

I'm not quite sure what to think about TR's legacy, given what we know now. He left the first time during an offseason where very crucial decisions needed to be made (trading Johan, negotiating contracts for Cuddyer, Hunter, etc.) Of course the cancer diagnosis played into that decision to leave the first time...

Now this time, it's been reported that he orchestrated his exit, and he decides now is the time to do so 2 weeks before a critical trade deadline.

He's done good for the organization, but man, he's now left twice before having to make franchise altering decisions.

 

Is this year's trade deadline really going to be considered "franchise altering"?  I would like to see them unload some vets, but franchise altering might be pushing it.

[old nurse]

Jim Pohlad is becoming George Steinbrenner

[Boom Boom]

I don't like the commitment to Molitor. It complicates the GM search.

[Deduno Abides]

The statement by Pohlad that the new GM can't fire Molitor is really disturbing.

Isn't that kind of like saying he knows better? Also that off the bat isn't a good recruiting statement by the owner. Sends up a red flag that he will meddle

Agree. The bright side is that Pohlad has shown he can change his mind a few months later. Once he starts talking to candidates, he might realize that he'll need to move Molitor to get the person he wants, just like Glen Taylor had to walk back statements about his front office this year.

[Deduno Abides]

The new Angels GM inherited Trout and Pujols. The new Tiger GM inherited Miggy and Verlander. Etc, Etc, Etc, That Bill Smith obtained the most positive parts of the teams future is a myth.

Curious: which part do you think is a myth: that Smith signed or drafted Sano, Kepler, Buxton and Berrios, or that they're the most positive parts of the team's future?

Edited July 18, 2016 by Deduno Abides

[Mr. Brooks]

Agree. The bright side is that Pohlad has shown he can change his mind a few months later. Once he starts talking to candidates, he might realize that he'll need to move Molitor to get the person he wants, just like Glen Taylor had to walk back statements about his front office this year.

Maybe, but how many good candidates will cross themselves off our list, due to a perception that ownership will meddle, before Pohlad comes to that realization?

[Deduno Abides]

Maybe, but how many good candidates will cross themselves off our list, due to a perception that ownership will meddle, before Pohlad comes to that realization?

Who knows? There aren't many of these jobs; a lot of people will at least take the call. It will have other red flags, also, such as budget, openness to innovation and control generally, but hopefully not Golden Gopher football-sized red flags.

Edited July 18, 2016 by Deduno Abides

[operation mindcrime]

I've never been a manager but I feel I could've done a better job than Ryan. I would've done a full rebuild after 2012. Ryan wouldn't have but he should've after 2013. I never would have renewed Gardy's contract after 2013. I would've traded Willingham to the Orioles when they claimed him on waivers. I wouldn't have signed Kendrys Morales. I wouldn't have extended Perkins, Hughes or Dozier's contracts. I also never would've signed Nolasco or Santana. I'd have saved tens of millions for the franchise with possibly better results. Now with all that being said, I don't know what trades or free agent signings I'd have made, or what personnel I'd have hired. But it couldn't have been any worse imho.

[Mr. Brooks]

Who knows? There aren't many of these jobs; a lot of people will at least take the call. It will have other red flags, also, such as budget, openness to innovation and control generally, but hopefully not Golden Gopher football-sized red flags.

By saying there are only so many of these jobs, you are already lowering your aim. The best and brightest minds are not going to feel like they can't pass up a job because there are only so many. The best and brightest are going to have multiple teams vying for their services. Guys like that are going to laugh at an owner choosing the manager. Shouldn't we be setting our sights on those guys, not just the guys who are going to take the first job offered?

 

If I'm a highly sought after potential GM, I'm not even considering a situation where I can't even choose my own manager.

[h2oface]

If the current Twins assistant GM was the combined spirit of Branch Rickey and Ed Barrow and said spirit had a double major in Statistical Analysis and Quntitative ESP, I still wouldn't want him.

 

This team needs gutting and the smell of failure and stubbornness needs to be throughly exercised from the whole organization.

I agree, but someone has to be interim GM, since I didn't get the job.

[Riverbrian]

This was the right move and it's something that I have advocated for the past few months. 

I do want to say that it was very painful to advocate that and now that it has happened... it's still somewhat painful even if I got what I wanted. 

 

Here's the deal... The Twins are mine. I've invested myself in this club and I plan to continue investing myself into this club. I don't know another way and I don't want to know another way. We all got to put our passions into something. 

 

Anybody else who invests themselves in my club is my teammate and that is how I viewed Terry Ryan all these years... Regardless of how I felt he performed in his very important role. 

 

I wish Terry nothing but the best and I honestly thank him for his efforts on my behalf as the biggest Twins fan in the world. 

 

I realize that this is how it must begin... but it can't stop here. Yes... Terry Ryan was where the final decision buck stopped.

 

However... I assume that he was operating on the advice of his many employees and that is what needs to be assessed next.

 

I certainly hope that someone will be reading all reports to find out who advocated what and that each member of the front office is properly assessed on the merits of each suggestion that led to getting us to where we are. 

 

 

 

 

 

[bird]

 

No experienced GM is going to want this job.  It's either Antony or some other first time GM.

 

 

Yeah, for sure, you know, unless they round up everyone that was hired under Terry Ryan and fire all of them.

[Jham]

Supposedly Ryan asked for dismissal if he was just going to be fired at the end of the season. I do not think this was planned.

[Mr. Brooks]

Supposedly Ryan asked for dismissal if he was just going to be fired at the end of the season. I do not think this was planned.

But there was still supposedly a 3 or 4 week gap in there. So, there is still a timing aspect there.

Maybe they wanted to wait until after the HOF weekend? That seems kind of trivial, considering there are actual baseball decisions that need to be made, other teams have already started making deadline trades.

Or, perhaps this is because of a disagreement, and rather than turn it into an ugly he said she said argument, all parties agreed to say it's been in the works for some time.

 

Even if you disregard the 3 week delay, we've known the season was lost for much, much longer than that, so there is another question of timing.

What changed on say, July 1st that was substantially different than on June 1st?

I'm not convinced there wasn't a specific philosophical difference involved here somewhere, though we'll likely never know.