The Twins need to sign Liriano to a 2-3 year contract ASAP

[DaveW]

He is the only one in the system who even has the ability to come close to posting 25k's in his last two starts.

 

I'd prefer 2/18 with a 10 mil team option, but would be totally fine with up to a 3/30 which is more or less what the Twins gave Pavano.

 

The upside is to high to just trade him away for a C+/B- prospect at this point.

[glunn]

This has been debated at great length on other threads. Almost everyone agrees that Liriano is an extremely risky bet. His upside is very high, but the more likely outcome is that he repeats his history and has long periods of terrible pitching.

 

I think that there are strong arguments to sign him now, and strong arguments to trade him now. With 25 strikeouts in 2 games, his stock is soaring, so both his trade value and the amount that he might accept for a multi-year contract are also soaring.

 

This is a tough call, but I agree with you that some offer should be made now, before the price goes up even more. My sense is that Liriano may be getting more mature as he grows older, and he may finally be getting his act together. On the other hand, based on Liriano's track record, I am probably wrong.

[jctwins]

Disagree. Another flash in the pan. Sell high and avoid making the mistake of hanging on too long and spending the cash that could be employed elsewhere.

[DaveW]

Disagree. Another flash in the pan. Sell high and avoid making the mistake of hanging on too long and spending the cash that could be employed elsewhere.

Where exactly would that money be spent though?

[snepp]

Where exactly would that money be spent though?

Joe Saunders baby, veteran presence.

[Esoteric Ball Guy]

Why would Liriano sign any extension for a losing team when he's 2 months from FA? Unless the Twins drastically overpay (think Oliver Perez and his 3/36 to resign with the Mets) there is no chance that Frankie will stay when all he has to do is have a decent last few months and cash in with whatever team he wants.

 

If you can trade him for a B/B+ prospect do it. If not, offer him the $12M qualifier and hope he turns it down. If he accepts, pray the good Frankie is around long enough to do this same dance next year.

[Guest USAFChief]

Joe Saunders baby, veteran presence.

 

You call THAT veteren presence?

 

We should totally toss Carl Pavano another $16.5m and I bet Ryan Dempster would listen if a 4 yr deal with an option were mentioned.

 

We can't be locking up lefties in their late 20's with swing-and-miss stuff.

[greengoblinrulz]

Liriano isnt gonna take a 3/30 deal right now. this is his best negotiating ploy now....to not sign & go to FA

[Top Gun]

If you can't sign your only best pitcher, what are you trying to do?

[greengoblinrulz]

Amazed that everyone has forgotten the Liriano of last yr & of April/May this yr.

Ive been on record that he HAS to be dealt but if they want to resign him this offseason, so be it....but he has to go now.

[Shane Wahl]

No. Offer the amount needed to get the two picks back if he declines the offer. He will likely decline. Draft college pitchers with those two picks. Laugh as he never goes below a 4.00 ERA for a season again.

[James Richter]

No. Offer the amount needed to get the two picks back if he declines the offer. He will likely decline. Draft college pitchers with those two picks. Laugh as he never goes below a 4.00 ERA for a season again.

I had this misconception as well, but MLB Trade Rumors cleared it up the other day. The Twins would only get one pick back for Liriano, and it would be the sandwich pick. So if somebody offers a prospect who's as good or better than a 30-something overall selection, that's all it should take to pull the trigger on a trade.

 

Having said that, it probably couldn't hurt to offer him a 2-year extension at $10M/season or less right now. If he turns it down, oh well. If he accepts, check one pitcher off the shopping list. I know we'll all go crazy if he forgets how to throw strikes again, but any of the other FA SPs could break down and turn out to be a waste of money, too. Should we prefer the devil we know?

[spideyo]

If you are going to re-sign him based on his turnaround this year, then you need to be prepared to hand a roster spot to Butera as well. He has pitched extremely well with Butera behind the plate, but was absolute ****e with Mauer and Doumit. Coincidence? Maybe. But then again, it's always seemed that Frankie's problems are more mental than anything, and when you've got a guy who bounces between "potential HOF Ace-type production" and "would get fired from the Saints", would you be willing to risk changing ANYTHING from his routine?

 

Now, I'm personally ok with keeping Butera as his personal catcher, with Doumit and Mauer platooning catcher and DH the other 4 starts. I know most people are not.

[Top Gun]

Butera might have to pitch the other days.

[DPJ]

Another classic overreaction by Dave when it comes to Liriano, hell you wanted to sign him to a new contract after 20 meaningless spring training innings.

 

But then he throws a couple clunkers and you're the first one making "F*CK LIRIANO" threads.

[twinswon1991]

Why would Liriano sign any extension for a losing team when he's 2 months from FA? Unless the Twins drastically overpay (think Oliver Perez and his 3/36 to resign with the Mets) there is no chance that Frankie will stay when all he has to do is have a decent last few months and cash in with whatever team he wants.

 

If you can trade him for a B/B+ prospect do it. If not, offer him the $12M qualifier and hope he turns it down. If he accepts, pray the good Frankie is around long enough to do this same dance next year.

Agree 100%. There is no way his agent lets him resign with a rebuilding team unless there is a huge overpay. Frankie would be better served taking a year deal with an NL club than coming back to a last place team.

[IdahoPilgrim]

I understand the allure of wanting to resign Liriano, being as starved for pitching as we are.

 

If this happens, though, just be warned of the potential of 2/3/4 years (however long his extension is) of "I told you so" if he tanks again. We will be merciless.

[Yoshii]

Clearly Liriano needs a Joe Mauer contract with his recent performances.

[Badsmerf]

The Twins are in a good situation here. With Grienke struggling and Hamels close(?) to signing with Philly, he is the best arm available. Plus, he has a 12m option for next year so he's not going to go straight into FA. What team other than the Twins would give him a long-term contract? He'd be better off accepting the 12m and putting together a great season next year. Then he's still on the right side of 30 and can try to get a 3 or 4 year deal. If the Twins don't get a good offer, just keep him. Maybe work with his agent and see if they are going to accept the 12m and if not throw out a little more on a 1 year deal. They have to understand Liriano has to prove he's worth a long-term commitment.

[tpb8]

Every year the Twins count on Liriano and every year he lets them down. He had an awful 1st half of this season but he pitches well for 2 months and we want to extend him? He gets paid for a full season each year. Tell me, when was the last time he put together 1 full season of above average numbers? This is a guy you want to invest in long-term? Hopefully Terry Ryan is smarter than you are. Trade him, or offer him the 12 million and hope he turns it down.

 

For those of you clamoring for the Twins to make an offer to him now......nobody signs a deal 2 months from FA. Certainly not a team-friendly deal.

[Mike Sixel]

Why would he sign for 10 million per year? That is at least 2-5 million under what he will get in fa. I would trade him, and then if you believe in him try to sign him in the offseason.

[minn55441]

The Twins are in a good situation here. With Grienke struggling and Hamels close(?) to signing with Philly, he is the best arm available. Plus, he has a 12m option for next year so he's not going to go straight into FA. What team other than the Twins would give him a long-term contract? He'd be better off accepting the 12m and putting together a great season next year. Then he's still on the right side of 30 and can try to get a 3 or 4 year deal. If the Twins don't get a good offer, just keep him. Maybe work with his agent and see if they are going to accept the 12m and if not throw out a little more on a 1 year deal. They have to understand Liriano has to prove he's worth a long-term commitment.

No doubt in my mind that now is the time to deal Frankie. His value on the market will not get higher than it is right now. We should get some value in return in a trade at this point. As smerf pointed out, he may be the best pitching option available this season as we approach the deadline.

 

With his track record, I would be really hesitant to offer him a deal longer than one year. I know he has upside, but he also has a lot of downside and we have seen it all to often. How tied to Rick Anderson and the Twins organization do you think Frankie is? He seems like a pretty quiet and humble guy. Do you think that he would make his free agent decision based more on his comfort level rather than the dollars on the table?

[Top Gun]

No way in hell will you be able to sign him in the offseason!

[IdahoPilgrim]

The Twins are in a good situation here. With Grienke struggling and Hamels close(?) to signing with Philly, he is the best arm available. Plus, he has a 12m option for next year so he's not going to go straight into FA. What team other than the Twins would give him a long-term contract? He'd be better off accepting the 12m and putting together a great season next year. Then he's still on the right side of 30 and can try to get a 3 or 4 year deal. If the Twins don't get a good offer, just keep him. Maybe work with his agent and see if they are going to accept the 12m and if not throw out a little more on a 1 year deal. They have to understand Liriano has to prove he's worth a long-term commitment.

No, he doesn't. He's a straight free agent after this year. The $12M number some people are floating around is what would be required to be offered to him in arbitration in order for the Twins to get a draft pick as compensation if he declines, under the new CBA.

 

We trade him now, or we probably end up with nothing for him when he signs with someone else in the offseason.

[Jim Crikket]

No, he doesn't. He's a straight free agent after this year. The $12M number some people are floating around is what would be required to be offered to him in arbitration in order for the Twins to get a draft pick as compensation if he declines, under the new CBA.

 

We trade him now, or we probably end up with nothing for him when he signs with someone else in the offseason.

Exactly. His new team won't have the option of offering a "qualifying" arbitration figure and getting that sandwich pick if he turns it down.

 

Also, he doesn't have to "prove" he deserves a long term contract. Heading in to FA, all he has to do is prove that he throws left handed, can strike people out at a high rate at times and can pass a physical. With those criteria met, someone will overpay for him. It probably shouldn't be the Twins.

 

On the other hand, if Liriano were on another team and hitting free agency this year, he's probably exactly the kind of pitcher a lot of Twins fans would be urging Terry Ryan to roll the dice and take a chance on. The fact that we've all lived through the low-lights of his career up close and personal makes many of us less likely to want to continue doing so.

 

I also don't see why his agent would listen to an extension offer right now. Then again, I don't know why Cole Hamels' agent would either and it looks like that may happen. Of course it also looks like the Phillies may overpay to get that extension done.

[Mike Sixel]

Everyone keeps saying "overpay", but that's what the market keeps doing. Big money, and 3-7 years is what it takes to sign a big time, legit, free agent pitcher. It's not overpaying, it's paying the market rate.

[nokomismod]

I hope that Liriano just pitched his last game as a Twin. As much as this team needs starting pitching, he is not worthy of a long term or another 1 year deal. Even when things were going well, we never heard from Liriano or his agent, that he wants to stay. Am I wrong in remembering that about 3 years ago his agent tried to speed up his "free agent eligibility"?

[diehardtwinsfan]

First off, I highly doubt Liriano is going to sign an extension right now unless the Twins are going to overpay by a lot. Liriano is 2 months away from free agency and things have suddenly clicked for him. Unless Grienke implodes, Liriano is going to be in demand, even with the question marks.

 

Second, given his inconsistency, I'd be willing to go low base/high incentives with him. I doubt he and his agent would take it.

 

Third, Liriano has been kind enough of late to drive up his value. The Twins should be able to get something decent, and if they do not, they can make a qualifying arb offer and get a pick when he says no to arb. Not bad. I'd much rather flip that to a desparate team looking for pitching help and get a front line starter potential guy who is scuffling a bit in AA.

 

I'll be honest that I'm a bit skeptical of a long term contract for Liriano. I think he needs a change of scenery personally, and I wouldn't be surprised at all if he becomes "the one that got away." But given the headache and the frustration he's caused, I'd much rather sell while there is some value there.

[MidwestMeat]

Trading him will be the safest bet....

 

It's very unlikely we will get the appropriate amount of value from a sandwich pick if we let him turn down the qualifier unless we take a risk on a high upside/low likelihood guy that works through our system and finds top of the rotation stuff (keyword RISK)

 

If we sign him to an extension we are counting on the bubblegum and his new best friend butera fixing him for good and being the guy we always hoped. Unfortunately we all know how frankie is, and after 2 more years of incredible disappointments and brief flashes of brilliance his value will be shot and we will get nothing in return for his departure but the fantastic(?) memories (holy RISK)

 

We may not get A talent from trading him, but at least we will get some bodies that will most likely spend some time in Minneapolis.

[johnnydakota]

Disagree. Another flash in the pan. Sell high and avoid making the mistake of hanging on too long and spending the cash that could be employed elsewhere.

with our ownership?spend and money, the best we can hope for is jaime moyer....or the return of pavano and marquis....

 

when asked what jim pohlad likes to do in his free time , he responded with"i like to walk barefoot and see the free sites"

when asked why bare foot he answered "shoes cost money, skin grows back free"