Both have/had rock solid stats in the minors. Similar high 80's fastball and secondary pitches. Both refused to be called up by the Twins. Turns out that Slama was a career minor leaguer. Could it be the same for Atcher?

Could be. We won't know until he gets a shot, though.

Seemed to me that Slama got rocked almost every time he pitched at the MLB level.  I don't think that has been the case with Achter.  In fact I thought he did better in the pen last year than Oliveros IIRC.  The Twins need to give him a few more chances before we know what Achter brings.  He could be Slama II and the Twins certainly are not that confident in his abilities or he would be up.  He has earned the closer job in AAA and done a pretty darn good job in that role.  I think he can be a setup man but I don't watch him everyday either so what do I know.

Probably a pretty good comparison. Certainly need to add in the non-stop calls for him to be promoted. And the likely outcome that when he is promoted and turns out to be nothing special it will be the Twins fault for how they handled him.

Both were late college draftees (39th and 46th rounds).

 

To be fair, I think Slama got hurt before he got a chance elsewhere.  Otherwise perhaps he could have been a functional MLB reliever for a little while.

 

Slama got more K's but always had worse control.  What's most notable about Achter the past couple seasons is his very low hit rate.  He's another guy I would have liked to see more in 2014 and/or early 2015 -- if he's more suspect than prospect, and we have no plans to use him, it's costing us to keep him on the 40-man roster this whole time.

Similar stories at this point... Both have earned the right to get a shot with the Twins. 

 

Both not getting as much respect as they could... including people calling them different names, like "Archer."

I've been a proponent for Achter, in preference to signing guys like Boyer or not trading away guys like Fien.

 

However, I hadn't looked at Rochester FIP numbers on Fangraphs until now, and Achter's nice ERA looks like it may be something of a mirage by this measure. 3.69. Even guys like the maligned Mark Hamburger have more favorable FIP.

 

I'm not 100% sold on FIP being the ultimate projection tool, but maybe the AAA on-field staff are seeing the same things that FIP is trying to say, namely that he isn't having a standout season at this level and probably would not be a net positive asset if he were brought up?

 

Similar stories at this point... Both have earned the right to get a shot with the Twins. 

 

Both not getting as much respect as they could... including people calling them different names, like "Archer."

 

or maybe that is auto correct, and not some kind of dis? Or a typo, or something? Why assume the worst?

Edited July 10, 201511 yr by mike wants wins

or maybe that is auto correct, and not some kind of dis? Or a typo, or something? Why assume the worst?

The typo was in the title, and I don't know whether autocorrect affects titles or not.

 

For the record, I corrected the typo in the title (though not a different typo in the message body) around the same moment that Seth commented on it, so there could be some confusion on that count.

 

Similar stories at this point... Both have earned the right to get a shot with the Twins. 

 

Both not getting as much respect as they could... including people calling them different names, like "Archer."

 

Haha blame it on my phone's auto-correct! I haven't typed ACHTER enough in messages... meanwhile Duensing fills in perfectly, and my phone already assumes the next phrase... "is awful"

Edited July 10, 201511 yr by Vanimal46

 

However, I hadn't looked at Rochester FIP numbers on Fangraphs until now, and Achter's nice ERA looks like it may be something of a mirage by this measure. 3.69. Even guys like the maligned Mark Hamburger have more favorable FIP.

 

I'm not 100% sold on FIP being the ultimate projection tool, but maybe the AAA on-field staff are seeing the same things that FIP is trying to say, namely that he isn't having a standout season at this level and probably would not be a net positive asset if he were brought up?

As I noted above, limiting hits has actually been Achter's calling card the past couple years, rather than any standout performance in strikeouts or walks.  So it's no surprise his FIP is higher.

 

From another thread, I notice that Joaquin Benoit has had a similar discrepancy the past few years at the MLB level, so I wonder if FIP is slightly less useful for judging relievers?  That is, it's actually possible for a reliever with decent strikeout skills to sustain a H/9 figure around 5 for multiple seasons, which would be almost impossible for a starter.

 

As I noted above, limiting hits has actually been Achter's calling card the past couple years, rather than any standout performance in strikeouts or walks.  So it's no surprise his FIP is higher.

 

From another thread, I notice that Joaquin Benoit has had a similar discrepancy the past few years at the MLB level, so I wonder if FIP is slightly less useful for judging relievers?  That is, it's actually possible for a reliever with decent strikeout skills to sustain a H/9 figure around 5 for multiple seasons, which would be almost impossible for a starter.

 

FIP does seem less meaningful for relievers. But I would trust that more for someone doing it in the bigs vs AAA.

FIP does seem less meaningful for relievers. But I would trust that more for someone doing it in the bigs vs AAA.

How about Opponent OPS?

 

Or, given that relievers spend a greater fraction of their time in situational moments, e.g. two outs with a man on second late in a tie game, where a walk looks bad for OPS but is nearly irrelevant?

 

Both were late college draftees (39th and 46th rounds).

 

To be fair, I think Slama got hurt before he got a chance elsewhere.  Otherwise perhaps he could have been a functional MLB reliever for a little while.

 

Slama got more K's but always had worse control.  What's most notable about Achter the past couple seasons is his very low hit rate.  He's another guy I would have liked to see more in 2014 and/or early 2015 -- if he's more suspect than prospect, and we have no plans to use him, it's costing us to keep him on the 40-man roster this whole time.

 

Yeah they need to decide if he is a keeper or not as 40 man is crowded this coming year.  I think they left him unprotected one year and he got picked but wasn't kept so I think if they take him off he might be gone via the rule V draft.  If they don't think he can get the job done then they need to take him off though.