Hughes to bullpen?

[jimbo92107]

Phil Hughes admits as much: He's lost a couple of key mph off his fastball. Pitching coach Neil Allen has called it "dead arm" syndrome, and there's not much a pitcher can do about it except keep working out and hope it goes away. Problem is, the Twins can't afford to waste starts on a guy with a dead arm.

 

The answer could be relatively simple. When Ervin Santana arrives, put Hughes into the bullpen. A month or more without the constant wear and tear of starting might help Hughes get his heater back, and if the Twins actually make the playoffs, Hughes could be relatively fresh when Santana resumes his playoff suspension.

 

What do y'all think?

[Danchat]

If he moved to the bullpen, would it be a temporary move? For example, perhaps Hughes enters the bullpen and then eventually in August somebody gets hurt. You can plug him right back into the rotation.

 

But it wouldn't be a long-term move because his big contract. Perhaps he could return to starting next season and hope that his "dead arm" is gone?

 

But his contract is so big... can you even move him to the bullpen? Maybe Hughes will turn the corner and he'll find that couple MPH on his pitches. 

I sincerely doubt the Twins will do this, but they should at the very least consider it.

 

 

[Thrylos]

The Yankees tried it in 2009 (and that was their 103-59 World Champion team that blanked the Twins) and he was their best reliever that season not named Mariano.  His FB was up around 94.  But he was 23.

 

Might worth it, but the Twins have 4 more years and $50 million or so invested in him, and for this front office, that fact makes it a no-go.

[ashbury]

If management is serious about the "no scholarships" quote from a year-plus ago, this would be a logical temporary move.

[drjim]

If they are talking about it in this way, might be setting the stage for a temporary move. Does ease the numbers crunch when Santana returns and provides a needed boost to the pen.

 

50 million reasons it wouldn't be permanent, but a month or two could work.

[Thrylos]

 

If management is serious about the "no scholarships" quote from a year-plus ago, this would be a logical temporary move.

 

Management proved that they were not serious about "no scholarships" 2 years ago.  So that's that

 

And Hughes is not the Twins worst starter.  That would be Milone (but Nolasco will take care of that)

Going back to the "no scholarship" idea,  methinks that Mr Santana should be the one relegated to  the pen, because he messed up a tad...

[Linus]

For a short period of time why not? The starting excess needs to be used to fix the pen

[Otto von Ballpark]

Sure would have been easier on his original 3/24 deal.

[Linus]

Sure would have been easier on his original 3/24 deal.

Who cares? The money us spent and he can go back to the rotation next year. Do what you have to do to chase the playoffs

[TheLeviathan]

Well there you go, he's going to get DL'd as soon as Santana or Nolasco is ready.

[nytwinsfan]

Worth a shot. Not a bad idea.

[Twodogs]

I was just thinking, think like what the Royals had last year during the playoffs, once they got to about the 5th or 6th inning, the game was basically over.  They would bring in one dominant reliever after another until the game was over.  What if both Santana and Hughes went to the pen??  Those guys would light up the radar gun if they only have to get 3, 4 or 5 outs or so.  I mean management would sit down with them and explain that this is temporary to get the Twins into the playoffs and hopefully the WS!  Then next year those guys would be put back into the rotation when Pelfrey is gone and then there will be 6 or so guys again competing for 5 spots.  I think it would be worth a try, at least until one of the current starters falls apart, but maybe these guys are just crafty enough to put together decent seasons, like Radke, Tapani, and guys like that were able to do.  Hughes and Santana would blow people out of the water for an inning or so getting the Twins to Perkins.  It might be worth a try, at least until one of those other guys proves they can't handle it?

[Twodogs]

 

 

I was just thinking, think like what the Royals had last year during the playoffs, once they got to about the 5th or 6th inning, the game was basically over.  They would bring in one dominant reliever after another until the game was over.  What if both Santana and Hughes went to the pen??  Those guys would light up the radar gun if they only have to get 3, 4 or 5 outs or so.  I mean management would sit down with them and explain that this is temporary to get the Twins into the playoffs and hopefully the WS!  Then next year those guys would be put back into the rotation when Pelfrey is gone and then there will be 6 or so guys again competing for 5 spots.  I think it would be worth a try, at least until one of the current starters falls apart, but maybe these guys are just crafty enough to put together decent seasons, like Radke, Tapani, and guys like that were able to do.  Hughes and Santana would blow people out of the water for an inning or so getting the Twins to Perkins.  It might be worth a try, at least until one of those other guys proves they can't handle it?

I mean I think its a better idea than throwing Milone or Pelfrey into the pen.  At least with Hughes and Santana you'd have guys with real good strike out ability coming in?

[goulik]

 

And Hughes is not the Twins worst starter.  That would be Milone (but Nolasco will take care of that)

 

So what stats are you looking at to back up this comment? I don't get the Milone bashing. He has a history of getting good results...

[Rosterman]

Dead arm. Disabled list for sure. Minor league rehab. Nolasco is out for a longer period of time, too. I guess you can never have too much starting pitching. We might see Taylor Rogers as a starter for the Twins yet, with Logan Darnell close behind! And now we got room on the roster to add Mark Hamburger! The last couple of seasons of back-of-the-dump-truck starters SHALL return!

 

[Brock Beauchamp]

 

Dead arm. Disabled list for sure. Minor league rehab. Nolasco is out for a longer period of time, too. I guess you can never have too much starting pitching. We might see Taylor Rogers as a starter for the Twins yet, with Logan Darnell close behind! And now we got room on the roster to add Mark Hamburger! The last couple of seasons of back-of-the-dump-truck starters SHALL return!

That's not a concern quite yet. Ervin Santana is eligible to return in four games.

[DaveW]

Hughes isn't doing as bad as some people are making it out to be, I just think our expectations for SP have gotten higher this year which isn't a bad thing at all.

 

Hughes overall has been pitching fine other than giving up the long ball, if he can eliminate that down a bit then he suddenly becomes a sub 4.00 ERA pitcher again.

 

Look at his last 6 starts:

7IP 2 ER

7IP 2ER

6.2 IP 4 ER

4.1 IP 5 ER

7.2 IP 3 ER

6 IP 3 ER

 

That is 4 solid starts out of 6, 1 poor start and one "bad" start.

I can live with that.

[DaveW]

Also with a guy like Hughes he has earned a long leash and you have to have patience with him, if he was rocking a 5.80 ERA right now I may be on board with looking to put him in the pen, but it's far too early IMO to consider it.

[jimmer]

 

Also with a guy like Hughes he has earned a long leash and you have to have patience with him, if he was rocking a 5.80 ERA right now I may be on board with looking to put him in the pen, but it's far too early IMO to consider it.

Not trying to nitpick, but how has Hughes earned a long leash?  Is it because of what he did in 2014? I ask because this year he is performing way more like the Phil Hughes Baseball has seen this decade. 2014 was the weird blip.

[drjim]

 

Hughes isn't doing as bad as some people are making it out to be, I just think our expectations for SP have gotten higher this year which isn't a bad thing at all.

 

Hughes overall has been pitching fine other than giving up the long ball, if he can eliminate that down a bit then he suddenly becomes a sub 4.00 ERA pitcher again.

 

Look at his last 6 starts:

7IP 2 ER

7IP 2ER

6.2 IP 4 ER

4.1 IP 5 ER

7.2 IP 3 ER

6 IP 3 ER

 

That is 4 solid starts out of 6, 1 poor start and one "bad" start.

I can live with that.

 

And the poor start isn't even that poor. He can certainly remain in a rotation with that type of run.

 

I do wonder how much the dead arm is actually impacting him, maybe a breather in the bullpen could be of value.

[DaveW]

 

Not trying to nitpick, but how has Hughes earned a long leash?  Is it because of what he did in 2014? I ask because this year he is performing way more like the Phil Hughes Baseball has seen this decade. 2014 was the weird blip.

Yes it is because of what he did in 2014, he threw 209 innings of pretty damn good baseball and set an all time record for K/BB ratio.

 

He still isn't pitching poorly, he is just getting bit by the long ball which is at its highest rate in his whole career (which was previously spent in the bandbox that is Yankee stadium) I think those numbers will come back to normal on there own and I am confident that Hughes can pinpoint the adjustment he needs to make to keep the ball in the park at Target field.

 

If it is a dead arm, then just DL him for 15 days, and then bring him back into the rotation. Moving forward I am very confident that Hughes is not only one of our best 5 pitching options in 2015, he is actually one of the top 2 or 3.

[diehardtwinsfan]

yeah, I think they DL him.  He had a pretty sizable increase in innings from 2013 to 2014 (though he pitched 191 in 2012).  Give him some time on the DL and let his strength return.  It will also allow pushing back trading a starter to closer to the deadline. 

[DJSim22]

I guess he no longer has a dead arm...

[jokin]

 

I guess he no longer has a dead arm...

 

 

The velo was down tonight, but no matter, a little luck, a little guile- and a lot of good plays in the OF behind him.  (tonight's Cubs BABIP was .048.)

 

But still, as long as the Twins are in the playoff hunt, they can't think about dealing Pelfrey- with Hughes, Nolasco and Santana all still with ?s on their foreheads.

[spinowner]

 

That's not a concern quite yet. Ervin Santana is eligible to return in four games.

I'm sure this was a brain cramp. It's 14 (now 13) games.

[USAFChief]

Good results tonight, and perhaps the command was a bit better, but I thought he was more fortunate than good.

[DaveW]

Lol I love it, only Minnesota sports fans could find a way to gripe about a guy who goes 8 innings and allows 2 men to reach base all night.

[jokin]

 

Lol I love it, only Minnesota sports fans could find a way to gripe about a guy who goes 8 innings and allows 2 men to reach base all night.

 

I'm guessing you didn't watch a lot of the game, then?

[Brock Beauchamp]

I'm sure this was a brain cramp. It's 14 (now 13) games.

Carry the one. Derp de derp.

[DaveW]

I'm guessing you didn't watch a lot of the game, then?

I watched a little.

 

I'm a results guy, Hughes obviously did more than enough to keep the twins in the game and gave them a chance to win.

 

Hughes is definitely one of the top 5 pitchers overall for this team (with Santana back) and especially for moving fwd, if the twins are gonna make the playoffs Hughes will have a significant role is my prediction.