Article: Twins Waiting, Watching (And Wanting)

[Shane Wahl]

 

Not hoping so, of course, but what's your prognostication in case Pinto needs to be DLed?

 

Herrmann. And Nunez then is guaranteed a spot too. 

[Shane Wahl]

I am just asking not go give up on EVERYBODY (other than Dozier) from that 2011 NB team: It was Dozier, Herrmann, Parmelee, Benson, Bigley, Solarte, Romero, Singleton, and Chang. 

 

 

[diehardtwinsfan]

I don't know why, but I think Mauer would be the better outfielder...

[h2oface]

 

I don't think moving Ploufe from third to first means Vargas is gone but that they don't feel Vargas has good enough defense at first. Moving Ploufe also could give more opportunities to Escobar or Nunez as they can play third. sounds more like contingency planning to me as Mauer should be at first almost 100 percent of the time anyway.

Don't you have to plan for the 40 to 50 games that Mauer will be out because of injuries?

              

Edited March 23, 2015 by h2oface

[jokin]

 

Wait, what? 

What is the fascination with CF? There should be none. The 2016 and on answer is solved. Aaron Hicks clearly works until then. Everything else is just stupid. It's just stupid.

 

I dunno, Hicks continues to do some pretty stupid things himself.

[TheLeviathan]

There is a weird attitude up in here if Shane Robinson is considered a major leaguer and a prospect like Hicks doesn't get the now appropriate chance. es.

Hicks has had two lengthy chances which have resulted in historic awfulness. I'm no fan of Robinson, but it bothers me Hicks keeps getting gifted something he has repeatedly proven unready for.

 

The real stupidity lies in the crummy options we chose to come to camp with, but I am beyond confused as yo what Hicks has done to entitle himself to so many chances.

[Shane Wahl]

 

I dunno, Hicks continues to do some pretty stupid things himself.

 

I know of one. What else? And is that the kind of thing that is really going to mean a roster decision favoring the likes of Shane Robinson? haha!

[Shane Wahl]

It isn't clear to me why I have to say this for the 7th or so time. 

 

Look at Hicks' minor league development. Ok, *nothing* warranted a move to MLB in 2013. It was stupid, especially as a leadoff man. He should have spent 2013 between AA and AAA. 2014 would have been his AAA/MLB taste on a normal schedule for him. If this were the case, his 2013 numbers might be about .760 OPS and his 2014 numbers in AAA at least post .700. If one thinks of his 2014 time in the majors as his true first time in the majors, then it is not that egregious of an output. He just has to make more contact and increase his slugging. These are improvable skills. 

 

Schaffer and Robinson as what? Improvements for a *rebuilding* team? What kind of craziness allows for this to be reasonable on any level? 

[jokin]

 

I know of one. What else? And is that the kind of thing that is really going to mean a roster decision favoring the likes of Shane Robinson? haha!

 

The fact is, it's a Hobson's Choice, no matter which direction the Twins choose to take.   I can see the logic of going with the two veterans for 30-60 days (and the likely below league-average offensive performance) to see if a stint in AAA helps Hicks improve from both sides of the plate.    At this point, however, we have two years worth of major league data, that Hicks, at best, projects as a platoon OFer.    And based on the latest quotes, the Twins don't want to go the platoon route if they don't have to do so.    Which leaves... what?

Edited March 23, 2015 by jokin

[TheLeviathan]

Schaffer and Robinson as what? Improvements for a *rebuilding* team? What kind of craziness allows for this to be reasonable on any level?

The craziness of not wanting to give up on Hicks. To want to give him a few months in AAA to prove readiness. I really worry Hicks coming north is a career death sentence.

[h2oface]

 

There is a weird attitude up in here if Shane Robinson is considered a major leaguer and a prospect like Hicks doesn't get the now appropriate chance. 

 

Hicks should be in CF and May should be the 5th starter. 

Hopefully the bullpen can have some gas tossers. Without Oliveros and Tonkin, though, yikes.

While I am in agreement with you on center and the 5th starter, I think Shane Robinson deserves to be considered a major leaguer. He has always been a fine sub/replacement player in his time with the Cardinals, and he hit .429 (3/7) in 3 games (2 as a pinch hitter and a start in game 6) in the 2013 NLCS. He hit a Major League pinch-hit solo homer against the Dodgers (Howell) in the 7th inning of game 4 for an insurance run and a 4-2 lead and the final scoring, and had two singles off Kershaw in his first two at bats in the clinching game 6, tagging Kershaw with the bases loaded and two outs for a couple more RBI in the third. He may not be the answer for the Twins in center, but he should definitely be considered a major leaguer. 

I feel the bullpen will be a major problem until they get some help, hopefully from Burdi and Reed.

[h2oface]

 

re: Centerfield and 5th SP battles.  I think that the Twins are in a position to bundle someone like Milone and someone like Hughes and another prospects and see whether they can get a major league centerfielder for a season or three, until Buxton gets ready...

Why not just trade Meyer for a centerfielder? The Twins don't want to promote him anyway. I hear he can be traded for a pretty fine center fielder.

[Thrylos]

 

And, uh oh, Shane getting wound up . . . 

 

I read in the game thread for yesterday's game that Hicks clearly misplayed a ball in the second inning allowing an extra base. I dare anyone to watch that again and say the same dumb thing. That ball was clearly by him. Good god.

 

Yesterday I was about 70 feet from where that ball landed.  It landed about a foot and a half ahead of his foot.  The major problem with that was that he was playing too shallow.  The good old days Liddle used to position OFs; if that is Vavra's job now, shoot me.   But that was the major issue with that play. 

[Thrylos]

 

Wait, what? 

What is the fascination with CF? There should be none. The 2016 and on answer is solved. Aaron Hicks clearly works until then. Everything else is just stupid. It's just stupid.

 

So you think that Buxton will be hitting breaking balls by 2016?  I still am not sure about that...  Got to see to believe.

[Dman]

Don't you have to plan for the 40 to 50 games that Mauer will be out because of injuries?

           

 

Yeah I guess I forget how fragile he is. Near 100 percent probably wasn't a good statement there. My main point was that it didn't necesarily spell Vargas's doom.

 

Granted Vargas might be out be out if they are going with multiple,outfielders and DH Arcia, Mauer, Hunter etc. maybe then there isn't room for Vargas. Hard to say for sure.

[jokin]

 

Yeah I guess I forget how fragile he is. Near 100 percent probably wasn't a good statement there. My main point was that it didn't necesarily spell Vargas's doom.

Granted Vargas might be out be out if they are going with multiple,outfielders and DH Arcia, Mauer, Hunter etc. maybe then there isn't room for Vargas. Hard to say for sure.

 

I too hope this is not the case, but fear the worst.

[Shane Wahl]

 

Yesterday I was about 70 feet from where that ball landed.  It landed about a foot and a half ahead of his foot.  The major problem with that was that he was playing too shallow.  The good old days Liddle used to position OFs; if that is Vavra's job now, shoot me.   But that was the major issue with that play. 

 

Wait we are talking about the same ball in the second inning, right? Because your characterization is flat-out false. I watched it several times. It landed several feet beyond and away from him. 

I am alarmed by this. you weren't the original poster about this in the game thread, obviously.

[Shane Wahl]

Someone find the video?

[Shane Wahl]

If he dove, that ball is a triple because he wasn't catching it.

 

On television they actually showed the flight of the ball from up and behind home plate. Not a possible catch. End of story.

Edited March 23, 2015 by Shane Wahl

[howeda7]

 

 A platoon plan for CF may not be ideal, but we are waiting for Buxton - Hicks, Schaefer, et al are not the answer long term but there is no reason a CF platoon can't work in 2015.  Or in RF or LF for that matter - get Rosario up here and let him play! Casey Stengel (Yankees) and Gil Hodges won World Series' by platooning players.  If Hicks can figure it out from both sides of the plate, great.  If not, platoon!  Don't know why this is a dirty word.

So did Tom Kelly (Pags and Leus) I thought a platoon has made sense the last couple years with Hicks and Pressley or Pressley/Mastro. It certainly does again.

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

I think all it really means is they like versatility and are trying to give themselves options.  I don't read anything more into it.

hope you are right!

[stringer bell]

I was at the game and thought Hicks took a poor route for the ball in question. I didn't see his jump, but he has disappointed in the past.

 

As for Plouffe playing first, it could make it easier to promote Sano in the event any corner infielder injury (plus Vargas).

 

My best guess is that Pinto ends up on the concussion DL. Herrmann could win the backup job and delay the competition between Rosario and Herrmann.

[Hosken Bombo Disco]

Why not just trade Meyer for a centerfielder? The Twins don't want to promote him anyway. I hear he can be traded for a pretty fine center fielder.

actually Ryan's original quote in 2012 was something like "you just can't get a pitcher of Meyer's quality for as cheap as a starting center fielder in his prime, unless the pitcher is still in A ball"

 

So there's that

[Richie the Rally Goat]

It isn't clear to me why I have to say this for the 7th or so time. 

 

Look at Hicks' minor league development. Ok, *nothing* warranted a move to MLB in 2013. It was stupid, especially as a leadoff man. He should have spent 2013 between AA and AAA. 2014 would have been his AAA/MLB taste on a normal schedule for him. If this were the case, his 2013 numbers might be about .760 OPS and his 2014 numbers in AAA at least post .700. If one thinks of his 2014 time in the majors as his true first time in the majors, then it is not that egregious of an output. He just has to make more contact and increase his slugging. These are improvable skills. 

 

Schaffer and Robinson as what? Improvements for a *rebuilding* team? What kind of craziness allows for this to be reasonable on any level?

this is how it should have happened, but it didn't. 2014 wasn't his first season in the majors, it was his second. His hitting was aweful but can be improved. His fielding was awful that can be improved too. So you have a prospect who is an awful hitter and poor fielder(-10.9 UZR per Fangraphs) on the big league club. That's doing him and the club a huge favor. Are Robinson/Schaffer batter? Maybe fielding wise, but if they struggle, who cares they aren't prospects. All of Hicks' issues might be fixable but is the big leagues the place to do it?

[John Bonnes]

 

Plouffe working at first base makes me think that Vargas will not come north.

 

FWIW, I don't think that is the case. I think they were just giving Plouffe some experience there in case he needs to move there during the season. (I think it's much more likely that Molitor is thinking ahead to what his options might eventually be if Sano is promoted. )

[John Bonnes]

 

I was at the game and thought Hicks took a poor route for the ball in question. I didn't see his jump, but he has disappointed in the past.

.....

 

My best guess is that Pinto ends up on the concussion DL. Herrmann could win the backup job and delay the competition between Rosario and Herrmann.

 

If you're talking about Friday's game, Molitor didn't have any problem with Hicks' actions on that ball. He would have liked him to catch it, but said he did what he was supposed to do but just didn't get it.

 

Terry Ryan said today that if this was the regular season, Pinto would have been put on the DL. Since it is not, and they have time, they're going to see what happens. They don't need to put anyone on the DL for two weeks, I don't think, so which DL he might go on is kind of moot. And he may not go onto one at all.

 

One thing I didn't mention is that Ryan said he saw Pinto this morning and was very encouraged by his condition.

[stringer bell]

Thanks John. From my point of view, Hicks pursued the ball laterally, and the ball landed beside him. My high school coach once said if you are running directly behind a ball to the fence, you've taken the wrong route. At the time, I thought it cost a base. Maybe my viewing angle was wrong.

[stringer bell]

On Pinto, is there not a competition for the backup catcher position? If Pinto is out 4-5 days, it has to hurt his chance to go north with the team, probably unfairly. We all have seen concussion symptoms linger, so I don't think it's out of the realm that Pinto gets disabled retroactively, rehabs with Rochester to catch up for missed time a d returns to the Twins awhile after the season starts.

[Boom Boom]

FWIW, I don't think that is the case. I think they were just giving Plouffe some experience there in case he needs to move there during the season. (I think it's much more likely that Molitor is thinking ahead to what his options might eventually be if Sano is promoted. )

The thought had occurred to me, but the question that raises is how a Sano promotion would open up playing time at first with Mauer entrenched there.

[Otto von Ballpark]

Wait, what?

 

What is the fascination with CF? There should be none. The 2016 and on answer is solved. Aaron Hicks clearly works until then. Everything else is just stupid. It's just stupid.

I'd rather not waste another season at the position, as we already wasted one, arguably two. And if Buxton hits another stumbling block again this year, wasting 2015 makes it more likely you will be wasting the spot again in 2016.

 

No one is suggesting a megatrade or huge FA signing. And whatever decent solution you find for CF could still have value post-Buxton, in a corner or by trade (kinda the value we all still hope Hicks achieves).