Trevor Plouffe, Trade Candidate?

[jokin]

 

 

The redundancy around here lately is really starting to make me grumpy.

 

Redundancy is a positive feature in many systems. MIght want to take it up with one of the more positive mods? Riverbrian and Ash seem to be in good moods lately.

[Richie the Rally Goat]

There s already a thread called Treor Plouffe - Trade Candidate, do we really need one specific to a trade to SF?

 

The redundancy around here lately is really starting to make me grumpy.

oops! I should hae looked closer. Sorry to offend your delicate sensitivities JB.

[Twinsoholic]

I am not grumpy about the duplication, if that is what you call it, about Plouffe and a possible trade. It is not always easy to find the "first" thread on a topic as there are so many, well, topics on this forum. Writing up to the minute, i.e., thinking about consequences for the Giants given Sandoval's signing with the Red Sox makes sense to me

 

Let's get excited rather than grumpy about some hot stove discussion. Plouffe is a California guy, although I cannot remember from what part of the state he hails from. 

 

If the Twins could get a top prospect starting pitcher (someone who pitched no lower than high A ball last season) and a AA or AAA corner outfield prospect, someone with wheels and pop in his bat, then the Twins should consider such a move.

 

Plouffe is one of my favorite Twins players, but teams have to make moves that are going to make them better. I know that Chief regularly criticizes trading a current MLB player for prospects, and I understand his thinking, but I don't think the Twins will compete this coming season for a playoff spot, but I do think that they can start to compete in 2016, and their success will largely depend on their starting pitching (they have bullpen prospects galore, and some young killer bats--they need effective starters, and SF sure does seem to produce a lot of them).

[ashbury]

 MIght want to take it up with one of the more positive mods?

All the moderators satisfy your criterion.  Am I sure?  Why, I'm positive!

[Rosterman]

It has to be explored. Again, the Twins have to make a long-term decision. Where does Plouffe fit in the future. Yes, we can trade him and have a void like they had at third and shortstop for quite a few seasons when they traded someone else out of the position.

 

We all believe that Sano is the future (though many feel he will be better suited elsewhere).

 

The Twins have Escobar to play third of they desire, and hopefully both Escobar and Santana play to 2014 terms in 015.

 

There is no one else in the wings if the need arose (Doug Bernier) and no one to really pick up as a suitable backup (this side of Nunez)...so until the coming of Sano, it is lose-lose for the Twins at that position.

 

But Plouffe's value is at its highest, of sorts. He still ended the season injured and needs a clean bill of health. There are other teams the Giants could trade with, if need be. Do they have a prospect in the pipe? And if we trade Plouffe for a highend prospect, we lose if that "pitcher" doesn't make it.

 

But where does Plouffe fit into the 2016 and 2017 Twins. Super expensive utility guy. One year leftfielder. Someone non-tendered at some point? 

[nytwinsfan]

Two words: Andrew Susac. He is a catcher with both the glove/arm and the bat. Also, he is blocked by Posey in the short to medium run. Meanwhile, while the Twins org seems to have little to no confidence in Pinto behind the plate long term, and Turner's bat is questionable as a starting catcher. I'd rather wait to trade Plouffe until later in the year, but if the Giants would be willing to trade Susac straight up, or even with us throwing in someone else (Pinto or a reliever for instance), I'd absolutely do it.

[h2oface]

To assume Plouffe's value is at its highest is premature.  He has improved every year. He is at an age to keep improving.  No real reason to assume that he won't.  Some team will always need a third baseman.  Now is the time to be glad he is on the Twins.  I for one am tired of waiting for prospects. The only good thing about a prospect is that they become a valued player for the MLB team.  If a team always trades a player once that happens, they never contend.  If and when Sano can displace him..... he very well could be worth even more.  Escobar?  He needs to prove he is the one to keep, as well.

[beckmt]

I vote for keeping him in the short term, unless overwhelmed by an offer.  Sano may or may not make it at third.  After Sano Twins do not have a third base candidate above A ball.  Next year or after next year the picture should be clearer on the value of Plouffe, until then listen, but only move him if the value is right.

[DocBauer]

Now that Gardenhire and Anderson are gone, Plouffe definitely becomes the #1 hot button topic to debate I guess. (Nolasco probably close behind) Seems to me we've been down this road soooo many times now. But, we don't have a lot else to discuss right now, there is a timing factor...so OK...let's go there yet again.

 

If I'm Terry Ryan, I call up the Giants...I say hello...how is the weather?...any big holiday plans?...so sorry to hear you lost your best player and maybe the heart and soul of your team...did you hear we added gold outline to our uniforms?...and then I shut up. Being realistic, there are very few quality 3B options on the open or trade market for anyone, much less a team like the Giants that may be facing a gaping hole at the hot corner next season. (although they are a well run bunch that does a pretty good job year to year at finding solutions and moving forward) But under NO CIRCUMSTANCES do I initiate ANYTHING. And there are a couple strong reasons why.

 

1) Plouffe has turned in to a surprisingly solid ballplayer. Suspect defense has turned to solid, possibly even above average. I honestly believe bunts and slow roller bare-handed grabs and throws has become a specialty. At age 27/28 he had his best overall year. You can debate the meaning of numbers and stats endlessly in a game seemingly based on numbers and stats, but amongst ML 3B in 2014, Plouffe ranked 1st in doubles, 12th in HR's, 12th in OPS and 6th in RBI. Depending on how you examine his numbers, Plouffe ranks anywhere from the top half to top third in all of MLB for productive 3B.

 

2) I am a HUGE believer in Sano, and believe he WILL BE the next Twins 3B, though he is still growing in the position and will be for a while. Like Gaetti, Koskie, and now Plouffe before him, and like most all ML 3B, he will struggle and grow at first. The only problem with Sano is missing last season. Do his incredible talents supercede everything and he magically makes the club out of ST? Does he need the whole year to get back and get ready? Somewhere in between? I LOVE Escobar and what he did, and not sure he's done. But do I want to trust 3B to him full time at this point?

 

3) Plouffe is coming off his very best season and is still only 28. Realistically, overall, he should have another 4-6 healthy, solid, productive seasons available to him...assuming no sudden regression. He may not be a full member of the Twins rebuild, but he's no graybeard either! This adds value to him as a Twin, and for any other interested parties as well.

 

I would absolutely plan to hold on to Plouffe for the 2015 season. I wouldn't make a single phone call offering him. If SF or someone else calls with a very nice offer in which they are willing to overpay a bit...and considering the dearth of quality 3B options available they may have to...then I listen closely.

[jokin]

Two words: Andrew Susac. He is a catcher with both the glove/arm and the bat. Also, he is blocked by Posey in the short to medium run. Meanwhile, while the Twins org seems to have little to no confidence in Pinto behind the plate long term, and Turner's bat is questionable as a starting catcher. I'd rather wait to trade Plouffe until later in the year, but if the Giants would be willing to trade Susac straight up, or even with us throwing in someone else (Pinto or a reliever for instance), I'd absolutely do it.

 

How desperate is San Francisco?  Let's wait and see if they whiff on Headley. The return might go even higher. in some sort of multiple player deal from both teams,  Asking for Susac, +, the Giants have a bunch of decent-to-very-good prospect starting pitchers on the major league doorstep that are currently blocked.

[Richie the Rally Goat]

How desperate is San Francisco?  Let's wait and see if they whiff on Headley. The return might go even higher. in some sort of multiple player deal from both teams,  Asking for Susac, +, the Giants have a bunch of decent-to-very-good prospect starting pitchers on the major league doorstep that are currently blocked.

bingo. I think Plouffe is very good, his batting stats were top third for 3b' and his fielding was much improved. My concern is the Twins don't really have an immediate backfill, but the return could become too high to say no. Look at the crazy money Boston paid for two third basemen at the same time, neither of which regarded as good fielders.

[ashbury]

I wouldn't make a single phone call offering him. If SF or someone else calls with a very nice offer in which they are willing to overpay a bit..

Ah, the old "don't make the first call" gambit.  That has a familiar ring¹ to it...

 

^{1_{No pun intended.  And yet, there it is.}}

[Squirrel]

There s already a thread called Treor Plouffe - Trade Candidate, do we really need one specific to a trade to SF?

 

The redundancy around here lately is really starting to make me grumpy.

We try to cut down on the redundancy by merging similar threads when we catch them.  Since I was baking this evening, I didn't catch this until now.  Not sure what Ash's excuse was.  Oh, he was being positive.  

 

Anyway ... threads merged ... continue with the discussion.

[Bark's Lounge]

(Singing this)

 

Plouffe is the answer and you know that for sure

Plouffe is surrender, you got to let it, you got to let it go.

 

...and let him be the third baseman of the Twins now and in the future, I like playing the Plouffe games.

[Linus]

No way.  Here is my Thanksgiving wish for everyone: consider and accept the premise that if the Twins add a decent starter and a decent outfielder they can contend next year.  We cannot start trading players now until we have someone to replace them or we are back to "rebuilding"

 

If this isn't a good enough reason to not move him then consider this: Jason Bartlett.  After the Twins traded him, we had a black hole at short that still hasn't been fully filled.  The same thing could very well happen at third if we move him now. 

 

My only other thought on Trevor is that he should not be considered for the outfield.  If Sano takes over third (still a sizeable if), then you trade Plouffe but not until.

[Riverbrian]

If a team wants to overpay for him... Yes!!!

 

I doubt a team will overpay for him... So No!!!

 

If the Marlins offer Heaney... You Gotta do it.

[ScottyB]

After the Donaldson trade, does Plouffe's value become any clearer?  Gotta say this about Beane - he's not afraid to make a move, no matter how unpopular with the fans.

[nater79a]

If Sano appears able to handle 3rd base defensively, and Plouffe is putting up similar numbers to last year, then yes, absolutely trade him for a pitching prospect. His value is unlikely to get much higher, and Escobar can handle backup at 3rd. I'd try to wait until this summer, but obviously if a good enough offer comes sooner, then take it.

 

Why just trade Plouffe straight up for another player(s). Include him in a bigger package. 

 

If you really want to make a big splash, give a call to a team that's starving for offense and has top of the rotation starters to deal.  My target: the San Diego Padres.

 

The deal for me is Plouffe, Kennys Vargas & Stephen Gonsalves to the Padres for Tyson Ross, Yasmani Grandal & Alexi Amarista. Plouffe and Vargas give the Pads' some pop at 3B & 1B,respectively, something they desperately need. We get a top of the rotation pitcher that can be paired with Phil Hughes, and is team-controllable for 3 more years. Grandal, a former Cuban top prospect, can be used as depth at 1B/C with the departure of Vargas and the move of Yosmil Pinto to full time DH. Amarista is a utility guy that can play all over: 3B, SS, 2B & CF.

 

With this trade I would play Escobar at 3B until May/June when Sano comes up. Another temporary option for 3B is to sign a non-tender candidate like Gordon Beckham. 

 

With 22 quality starts in '14 (second in the NL behind Wainwright & Kershaw) Ross instantly upgrades the Twins' rotation now and at least a couple years into the future.