Article: "We've Got to, Otherwise We're Dead"

[DocBauer]

Second post:

 

After last season, when it seemed there was a real possibility of a manager change for the Twins, I had very mixed feelings. On the one hand, I was and am a fan of Gardenhire as a manager and good guy, as well as his staff in general. And I didn't, and still don't, feel all the blame rests on his shoulders, or his staff. I don't think Gardy just got stupid. No matter how disappointed we all were in 2011, that season still came out of the blue. Not saying I am...but...you could offer up multiple excuses for 2012. In a different post, someone, I can't recall who, pulled out a very interesting statistic that really surprised me in regard to teams winning 90+ games, then losing 90 the next season, before strongly rebounding in season three. We could argue and debate at great length about roster construction, injuries, lack of talent, waiting for the minors to build and provide talent the past few seasons, etc. And we could probably make as many logical, well thought reasons and excuses as we could points of blame and causality for the string of bad seasons.

 

I was 50-50 on a change last season. I felt it could be time, but felt some smart moves, health and a couple promotions could have out us back on track this season.

 

I still refuse to "blame" Gardenhire for this season. Have I had some real issues at various times? Absolutely! NOT saying we would have been a playoff team, or just shy, if Nolasco was 100%, Buxton and Sano hadn't missed all or most of the season, if/and the team had signed just one more quality OF option. But, things might have been at least somewhat different in the W-L column, and the season might be finishing on a more positive note whereby we weren't writing articles such as this.

 

Thoughts and perspective is all.

 

I still believe Gardy can do a good job. But I have come to the point where I now believe change is necessary simply for the team to grow, turn the page, and begin a new chapter. I don't know if "new blood" is the answer, especially as I feel many of the best options available to the Twins for said change would have Twins ties. I think it's more about a different voice, a different approach, a different perspective.

 

I don't know if it's going to happen. But 50-50 in opinion last offseason has now become an almost MUST to move things forward.

[Kwak]

Replacing any (all) of this management team is "change for the sake of change".  I find that offensive.  Ignoring the fans and combining such to retain anybody runs counter to what the entertainment industry is all about (maybe all industry?).  No one is going to prison or Siberia for goodness sake.  I have posted many times that this team's failures is not one person's fault but rather the fault of many.  Replacing one (or more people) doesn't mean those removed were "the only one's to blame."  A large fire generally rejuvenates the forest (or prairie) to an even higher level ofvibrancy.  Organizations have to purge themselves occasionally and since we can't turn back the clock, the best time to purge is now.

[The Wise One]

Replacing any (all) of this management team is "change for the sake of change".  I find that offensive.  Ignoring the fans and combining such to retain anybody runs counter to what the entertainment industry is all about (maybe all industry?).  No one is going to prison or Siberia for goodness sake.  I have posted many times that this team's failures is not one person's fault but rather the fault of many.  Replacing one (or more people) doesn't mean those removed were "the only one's to blame."  A large fire generally rejuvenates the forest (or prairie) to an even higher level ofvibrancy.  Organizations have to purge themselves occasionally and since we can't turn back the clock, the best time to purge is now.

The entertainment business is about making monet. Did attendance go up in 1986 because Andy Mcphail was a new GM?  The don't bother to sell a jersey with the GM's name on it.  (I don't recall seeing a XXXXL Gardenhire, Anderson, Vavre, or other coackes name on a jersey, either)  Changing management by fan's whims makes about as much sense as signing a catcher to an 8 year contract because they are a fan favorite.

[Steven Buhr]

I think some of you are arguing the extremes of the spectrum. Of course JUST changing management pieces because fans want that is not appropriate. Likewise, saying that changing management would have NO effect is equally absurd.

 

There WILL be new players in 2015. There are always new players. Some will be promoted, some will be signed as FAs. The result, overall, is likely to be much younger team than what the Twins began 2014 with.

 

As I wrote in the article, it's difficult for me to envision Ron Gardenhire being the best choice to lead the next group of young Twins. That being the case, it makes sense to me to identify and hire the person you DO think will be that guy.

 

The combination of new blood on the field AND new blood in field management could very well address the PR issues to a degree, as well. It won't solve them entirely until the team starts winning, but making changes communicates to your fan base that you've noticed things have gone off the tracks and you are taking action to fix those things.

 

In my mind, there are 3 things TR has to consider:

1- Does he feel Gardenhire is the right manager to guide the next generation of Twins over the next 5-7 years?

2- Does he not totally buy in to that, but isn't 100% certain he has identified who IS the heir apparent to Gardy for the nex generation of Twins?

3- Does he feel a degree of loyalty to Gardy based on past performance and Gardy's own loyalty to the Twins?

 

To my mind, there's only one of those factors that justifies keeping the status quo in place. If the GM genuinely feels his current manager is the best man to lead this team, not only now, but in the future, then he should stay with him, regardless of the public's views. If ownership disagrees strongly enough, they have the option of dismissing both men, but otherwise Ryan has to make decisions based on his own beliefs.

[The Wise One]

I could really get on the fire Gardenhire bandwagon except all I read for reasons to fire is conjecture and hyperbole.  Unless I missed it, at least no one said to fire the manager because you can't fire the players.

 

In terms of the on field product I would think there is a daily evaluation of what happened. The FO should be doing assessments of the players. If there is a difference between what you got on the field and for performance and what you expected out of the player then you have to figure out if it is the player or the manager responsible. That would hold true for the getting more than expected as well as the less than expected. So if the balance is a little less, you get the coach shuffle that was seen a couple of times. When you get a lot less than you expected, then Ryan will fire.